Are the Swiss intolerant of kids?

OK, looks like I should start learning German then.

Helpful advice:

If you know your child isn't going to like being at a place you want to go:

- make sure he's entertained with a toy

- spend as little time there as possible

- take your child to a place where he can have his tantrum without upsetting everyone around him

- placate him through a promise and then follow up on it

- find a babysitter

- don't go

I didn't know this was allowed. I'm going to always carry some masking tape with me from now on. Is it also allowed to use it on adults? Do you know when the cut-off point is, is it 18 years old? What if they're 20 and look 18? Do I need to ask for ID?

Yes, good general advice. The reason I rarely eat out here with the kids.

Unfortunately, I've read it's against the law not to send you kids to school where I've come across some of the worst offenders.

I'm sorry about that. It sounds like you've had a lot of bad luck.

My two kids are almost out of school. One child needed more help at school and there was only one teacher who didn't recognize that. The teacher and I were on the constant warpath with each other.

My other child had good teachers throughout his years.

Sometimes it's the draw of a straw.

As for taping a child's mouth, since we don't know the circumstances around it, it's hard to draw any conclusions. It just might be that the kid deserved it.

HELLO?!?!?!? NOBODY deserves violence, be it child or adult, deserving or non-deserving! On top of the physical aspect it's an absolute disgrace!

And I consider taping somebody's mouth as violence.

I'm really not sure that THE Swiss are not kid friendly at all. But it could be said that in general they are trying to keep away from the US/UK idea of the King Kid, the centre of all attention and rights, and never of responsibilities.

Not in the Victorian sense of being seen and not heard - but heard in turn and politely. There is a big difference. Certainly around here people are great with kids, and yet expect them to behave. Being happy and joyful is not the same as being loud and raucous.

In one of our local seconday schools here, a teacher actually hit a kid after weeks, months and on that day, extreme confrontation. He knows and has admitted he was wrong and should have been able to control himself, and has apologised. Are the other kids and parents trying to get him sacked? No, they have been to the school and even marching in the street to re-instate the teacher and asking for action to be taken against those few kids who are making it impossible for lessons to take place in a friendly and positive atmosphere, for something to be done to give teachers 'power' back to ensure the majority of students can learn without threats and disturbance. A very fine line, I know (having taught in inner city schools in the UK where teachers were regularly threatened by parents of 'little angels' who made life a misery for others- if a teacher dare to take steps to curb this). One reason that if I had to return to teaching- it would be here in CH and not in the UK.

The good of the collectivity is still, just, ahead of the right of the individual here. And kids are still, generally, made aware that every right is matched with a responsibility. And not a bad thing either, no?

Taping a child's mouth does seem extreme and un-acceptable I have to say. There are other ways to deal with noise!

Jaysus, I thanked olygirl before she put that last sentence in. WTF? Thanks has been removed.

You cannot seriously believe that an adult can tape a child's mouth under any circumstances. Get a grip.

As a form of punishment, it's inappropriate. But before jumping all over me and the world, I refuse to condemn a situation if I don't know the circumstances around it. Perhaps the kid wanted his mouth taped shut thinking he was cool. Perhaps the tape was on only 2 seconds and everyone thought it was funny. Perhaps it was all in jest with a hint of punishment behind it.

We don't know and that's I refuse to condemn until the facts are here. Kids tend to tell only one side of the story as many others do as well.

Again, as a form of punishment, it's inappropriate and I would be the first one to talk to the initiator of this sort of punishment.

If you think its bad here you should try the UK, where you can take a dog into a pub but not your children!

I absolutely agree - I also never though I'd look back at my time with kids in Paris and think how child friendly the Parisien(ne)s are.

BTW, my British passport holding but definately international children are nicely behaved kids, but even they get poisonous looks from people, perhaps in anticipation that they are going to be naughty.

I think the point is that nobody can help but be annoyed sometimes at noise either coming from kids or other sources but why interfere unless it is as somebody said before to help solve the problem...But again this is somewhat a well known behavior in some parts of this country where people tend to give you their opinions even when not asked for it...busy bodies I guess you call them?

I'm genuinely wondering how learning problems are diagnosed in very young children. At what point when a parent is dealing with these kinds of "tantrums" do they decide it's something out of the ordinary? I'm familiar with the checklists used for ADHD, for instance, but was wondering how it's approached here in Switzerland?

It seems to be a very challenging thing for a parent to deal with and when my little one arrives, who knows if I may go through something similar.

I would expect any culture to have a decent attitude towards kids and not think it is ok to shout at them, crush them in the tram, make them cry and expect them to be silent and doll like throughout meals. It's got nothing to do with British or American cultures clashing with the Swiss.

'fraid not. I've had more than my fair share of nonsense here in Basel

That is the 2nd time today that one of your posts has surprised me. Has your account been hacked as you are usually much more sensitive

I'm sorry if it offends people, but I find that the best way to stop my child having a paddy is to tell her she's being a baby and walk away.

By shouting at her or reasoning with her I am spending time on the behaviour and encouraging it rather than ignoring it and letting her deal with it herself.

Of course, I turn bright red and get het up, and I hate it. But people giving me looks does not help.

OTOH, on buses etc people are really nice when she is being good, a random old lady gave her a knitted stuffed toy for example, so I praise the heck out of her when she's good.

I believe it's called positive parenting, rewarding good behaviour and ignoring the child when there is bad. Since I started it I've had fewer paddies.

I always been lucky to have mostly very good experience of the kids and me going out. My daughter always had great comments and big smiles from the Swiss.

But I do remembering time on our way to the airport, we were sitting early morning in the train to Zurich. My daughter was in a beautiful mood and chatty it was just a great moment, she was happy!

A lady didnt appreciate to see a smiling little girl and thought it was better to make her cry instead. So here she was with her angry and squeezed face shhhhhhhushing at my daughter very loudly. Everybody around gave that lady a WTF look and smiled at us. My poor baby was going to cry when I started to make fun of the woman so she could think it was a joke.

Stupid biartch

Hi Mimi,

Thanks for your concern. Maybe I'm just having more problems expressing myself today. Thanks for the heads up. Have a good one!

The number of children diagnosed with various "conditions" (I'm not talking autism or learning difficulties, both of which need to be taken very seriously early on) that require lifelong expensive treatment seems to be in direct correlation with the number of paediatricians and other "child health specialists". Some countries are more affected than others...

It's ill-conceived rubbish like this that really makes me mad

Masking tape is designed to be relatively low tack and will come off easily. You should be using duct tape.

The problem is duct tape leave traces...