John, if you go to Comparis and run the the comparison calculator (not the withholding tax calculator) which looks at actual tax rates not Quellensteuer, it shows taxes on CHF 100,000 in all Gemeinden in ZH. The lowest tax rate (Neerach) is 11,092, the top rate is 13,605 (several Gemeinden). This includes federal, cantonal and commune taxes, as well as an option for church tax. Does the Quellensteuer calculator include federal taxes as well?
I haven't lived in ZH for many years, nor do I pay Quellensteuer - so take what I say with a grain of salt - but perhaps you'd best project something in the 11,000 range, as Quellensteuer is based on an average cantonal rate.
(FYI, when I run this calculator for my Gemeinde, it is fairly close.)
Looking at your various threads on costs, I wonder if you are getting too caught up in the details - no matter how intricately you try to plan, you will get 'Switzerlanded' many, many times once you move here. Look toward the highest range and prepare yourself for the worst while hoping for something a little less painful - it's the only way to stay sane.
Better yet, have your future employer run you an estimate of your tax liability.
All the best.
Which 'most people' are you talking about?
I was confused as well in the cost of living thread until this post
Cost of living - help needed to get it right
It is the "official" , Swiss Federal Agency calculator that is going to be the closest if income is over £120k (or if you are below and actually fill in a tax return)
http://www.estv2.admin.ch/e/dienstle...uerrechner.htm
Comparison websites are only useful for comparing one kanton/gemeindes against another I think
That's an excellent calculator; just plugged in some real numbers - it's pretty much spot on. Thanks, Bill!
These other calculators are no use for new people in Switzerland who pay tax at source.
All these non Quellensteuer calculators presume you know what your taxable income is, not your salary. I have no idea what that will be, like most people researching moving.
The Quellensteuer rate I believe is fixed per canton and when your salary is less than 120k your total income tax should be easy to work out.
Can someone please clarify this and that if you pay Quellensteuer that it includes the national, canton and commune tax.
Also can someone confirm that the comapris.ch Quellensteuer tax calculator is about right?
Dear Sirs
One night I really had nothing to do, and then at one o'clock in the morning I had a brainwave! I will write a long post about the taxation system in Switzerland. I will really try and explain it in stupidly simple terms, and then finally I won't have to read any more posts asking questions about how much tax they will have to pay.
Why is it that the f**ing rich b**ds cannot afford a tax advisor? Why is it, when Switzerland is known to be a well regulated low tax country, that these Scrooge type people must know down to the last dime how much tax they are going to pay?
I sat down and wrote a long post above, number 50 on 2nd January, only 7 days ago, explaining most of the taxation system here. I finished at 01:42 am after "Burning the midnight oil" and now I read a post from you saying you don't understand why Comparis and all the others get a different result. I expect you know this expression, RTFM
Yours etc.
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Thanks for the RTFM.
However I'm talking about Quellensteuer, which is what most if not all new arrivals will be paying.
The OP is breaking down a salary of 100,000 in Zurich. I think using tax return calculator to get a figure of 11k is wrong as they aren't taking off deductions. Also as everyone sends all newbies to this thread and these newbies will be paying Quellensteuer then that should be the basis of the calculations in the original post.
This thread is a sticky, the OP should be edited to contain all the relevant information gathered in all the replies. 60+ replies are very difficult to digest.
The question remains is the comparis.ch Quellensteuer calculator anywhere near accurate? The only people who will b able to answer this are people paying Quellensteuer or people with tax knowlage. This is why I created a 'clarification' topic in the tax section. Here this question isn't going to get the chance of being answered. Once it was then merging woul have been sensible.
John, in all the calculators, take a look at what changing marital status will do to your taxes.
Given your 100,000 example using both the Comparis calculator and the Accurity one given in Bill's post, a single person would pay close to the 11,000 mark. A married person closer to the 7000 mark.
You sound frustrated, that's understandable - but bear in mind that many people on this board, expats included, do not pay Quellensteuer, or live in different cantons, and that marital status, children, religion, etc. will all change the number.
The single most important concept that one has to understand about living in Switzerland: YMMV.
As explained already, every canton and every village and every church has it's own tax rates. Federal Tax is constant. If you calculate the average for your canton you can calculate your Quellensteuer.
If in January you feel you have been cheated and earn over CHF 120,000 per year, (Or have a 'C' permit) you can put in a tax claim and you might get something back, or you might get charged more tax depending whether you have been charged above or below the average rate.
Please look at the relevant cantonal tax website for the tax rates.
Do not look at Comparis or Homegate, these are not for you: I did write in simple English that these are for comparing and not for calculating!
One thing, you do realise don't you that health insurance varies widely between cantons, and even sometimes between adjacent towns.
My quote from 2.01.2011:
You can use Homegate and Comparis for comparing the taxation levels between two villages in different cantons. As you can see the calculators for Homegate and Comparis do not ask for your age, nor your sex, so the health insurance premiums are not accounted for and the stated tax levels cannot be individually accurate.
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Why are you determined to make this more complicated than it is, enter your information acurately and the numbers that come out will be pretty good whichever one you use. In short they are are reasonably accurate, and covered liberally on here so no need for wheel re-invention really.
You seem to want every I dotted and T crossed before you get here from the number of "how much" threads you have started, live a little, as living here is much more than the things purely financial things you are obsessing about.
First off let me make it clear I am not trying to start arguments, just want to try and clear this up for me and for every other future foreign national who gets sent to this thread.
With that in mind let me start with this to lighten the mood
Okay so I think the comparis.ch calculator is wrong, however using this pdf which lists the 2011 Zurich Quellensteuer rates we can easily work out what the "example" 100,000 a year person would pay.
http://www.steueramt.zh.ch/html/steu...if_a_QSt11.pdf
Taking the same profile, 1 earner, 2 kids and no religion the Quellensteuer tax bill would be 524 CHF per month.
A total tax bill for the year of 6288.
This is 5,163 a year less tax than the OP suggests using a tax return calculator. The reason is because these calculators generally don't take into account your "taxable income" this is your salary minus lots of thing like your lunch, travel costs, health insurance and lots of other things I guess. So dumping your Salary into a tax return calculator as "taxable income" is going to give you the wrong answer, sometimes double your tax bill.
The good thing for people considering moving to Switzerland is that Quellensteuer is same no matter what commune you live in the canton. So you can live in a expensive tax area and still pay 6288.
I do think the OP needs to be modified to highlight the importance of Quellensteuer, with a caution that the comparis.ch Quellensteuer calculator is not accurate.
Anyway I do hope that someone finds this useful.
Original Post updated.
Just as information, I pay Quellensteurer and I have no problem with the tax calculators, although Bill Door's seems pretty much about right.
None of them are 100% accurate, they are just there to give you a rough guide.
Yes they are accurate if you put your taxable income in. Coming from the uk this means salary, but in Switzerland this is not the case and leads to confusion. Once I am in switzerland it will no doubt all make sense.
Wanna bet? I don't think most things make sense here, but a lot of things don't make sense in the UK either. One just gets used to not understanding it all!
So I've finished my "costs" spreadsheet.
Thought it might be useful for someone, also to get some sort of constructive feedback on the figures if anyone is that way inclined.
Okay so I've used the tariff B for 2011 to work out my income tax, with no church and 2 kids.
http://www.steueramt.zh.ch/html/steu...if_b_QSt11.pdf
Social services that's pensions etc and I've made that 10%.
My food bill, I've looked at our current food consumption taken a highish month and doubled it then converted that figure into CHF.
Electricity you can see I've got a yearly consumption figure, I've then went to the Zurich suppliers website and calculated it the best I could with google translator.
Heating I took our UK oil consumption in ltrs and looked at current costs. Car tax is based on the types of cars we own here.
Anyway, this is the most organised I've ever been in my finances...my wife handles all this sort of stuff...but she needed convincing that the figures were going to work.
After all the questions and effort, that's what you came up with
Yes. Is this completely wrong?
Like I said before wheel re-invention is not required as what your asking has been covered extenstively and your situation is no different really, that said I see issues with a few of you numbers:
Rent being an obvious one, 2500 is going to be a stretch in Zurich, so your pushed out, which then impacts you travel budget, and you potential tax rates as they differ in various areas of the kanton. Car insurance depending on your car may be way off, we pay 1,400 (after a lot of searching) for a Laguna 1.9 with full no claims, been driving on the continent for 6 years with a Swiss license and I'm over 50, I did get a quote of 2,200, and my car is a left hooker. No TV unless you are planing sky freeview but if you can get Cablecom your only talking another 5 chuffs, if it's Swisscom another 40 or so, no nebenkosten (covers heat and hot water, and communal area maintenance, but your combined numbers are way low at any rate), no allowance for parking and that can be 200+.
In short those numbers could be up to 450 out before the thorny issue of rent raises it's head, and until you can tie down where can live as that's the key, you can make spreadsheets until your blue in the face... some thing's just can't be planned as accurately as you seem to want remotely.
It's pretty tough to do all this spreadsheet malarkey before you hit Swiss soil.... if you are this anal it's probably best to stay put.
If you don't speak the local lingo that will be your biggest problem... not whether or not to buy sliced bread or fresh
Figure out your gross income and work out your rent budget.
Then... just go for it