From PhD to industry, help

Visas, Permits, Passports and Naturalization
1
Hello,

I am finishing my PhD in molecular biology and biochemistry. I did my bachelor in physics and master in biomedical sciences in US, then worked in Delft technology Institute and also at Max Plank Institute.

Now I am looking for a job in Switzerland, in pharma or biotech company but it looks Mission impossible.

Any experience? How can I get a first job after academia? Which directions would be the most possible?

2

" Employment following study in Switzerland
Foreign nationals can be admitted to work without having to provide evidence of their status under the precedence rule if there is a significant academic or economic interest in their employment. This rule applies only to degrees from recognised Swiss higher education institutions (universities and universities of applied sciences)."

https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home…zulassung.html

If you studied at one of these then it should be possible.

https://www.swissuniversities.ch/en/…n-institutions

See the links in here for possible companies to apply to.

https://www.englishforum.ch/employme…itzerland.html

3
Do you have an EU permit or Swiss citizenship? If not you can basically forget about getting a normal job here seeing as you are fresh out of school. Any company hiring you would have to justify why they specifically need to hire you (a non-EU) over all the other EU applicants. The competition is very, very fierce, and with zero work experience you would not be a viable candidate (edit: unless you have a very, very niche skill set or expertise above standard molecular biology techniques).

That being said, a post-doc would be a good way to get a toehold in Switzerland, and it could eventually lead to employment. Have you looked at labs for doing a post-doc? There are quite a few labs that e.g. collaborate with industry or are connected with start-ups. Look at ETH Zurich, EPFL in Lausanne, or the state universities in Geneva, Lausanne, Fribourg, Bern, Neuchatel, Basel, Zurich, or St. Gallen. Some unis have separate departments for biology and bioengineering, bioengineering would tend to have more collaboration with industry.

4
I am not considering academia, since I decided to move industry. Doing a postdoc means closing my industry doors myself...

And as a PhD graduate after diploma I get 6 months working visa which has equal rights as Swiss person to be hired...

I am not here to discuss about the visa paperwork, it will not be a problem.

My question is about how to transition from academia to industry?

5
IF you graduated in Switzerland? If not the 6 months working visa does not apply. And the visa paperwork can effectively be a huge problem for non EU people.

6
Why on earth would you think that? I know literally dozens of people with a background very similar to yours who have done a post-doc in Switzerland and then transferred to industry. A post doc can make you a much more appealing candidate for many industry jobs.

Only if you completed your studies in Switzerland...

7

That's not true. Just apply for the jobs you are looking for via the career sites of the companies you are interested in. Its the same process as anyone else.

8
They did graduate in Switzerland it seems. They've been a member of the forum for a while too. I don't understand why everyone is thinking they didn't.

9
I did it because my PhD was within a EU project that had a Swiss company inside. In other words, networking + luck.

I know other people with a (bio)chemical curriculum abroad, they got a B permit first (with spouse or partner as sponsor) and then applied a lot. On average it took months while being already in CH, and not all of them ended up in the industry sector they wanted.

I mention the permit because I think it helped - how much exactly I can't say.

Most of the histories I know started with some sort of existing connection to Switzerland. If you don't have one, then as others said I would definitely apply for a PostDoc in CH, it would be your "foot in the doorstep" for at least 1-2 years.

EDIT: the OP location says "Georgia". Is the PhD being completed in Switzerland? This is a big boost. Then I would use any possible connection created during the PhD, and still considering PostDoc positions if the alternative is having to leave.

10
Maybe I am wrong but I only know of a Max Planck Institut in Berlin, Germany, and that seems to have been work experience. That ́s why I thought OP did not graduate here.

11

Actually it’s pretty clear.

So graduated in the US, although they’re doing a PhD at a uni here it seems.

12
Yes, I am graduating from swiss university....

regarding a postdoc, our technician was a postdoc and then stuck in academia, my friend after postdoc became a technician because industry said you are too old for the transition, and you are trained for academia... so, 90% of people around me got stuck in academia after doing a postdoc. And why would I complicate my life even more by doing a postdoc?

Again my question is not about postdoc or visa paper work, it is about how to transition from academia to industry, what was your experience, and beside of luck what helped

13
Still in the university? There's a lot of help available there. Get acquainted with university job fairs. Also, there are courses to learn how to adapt your CV to Switzerland's cultural preferences, how to apply for jobs, training on how to handle an interview and even salary/income discussion. When I did my PhD the student association invited graduates with 10, 20 or more years of experience in the industry every 2-3 months to talk us about their daily work life, salary/income and other interesting stuff for students that have no idea what to do after they finish school. So, you're not alone, most people have this problem. Use all the university and student association resources before you finish your PhD.

I guess it's a bit late now, but it helps a lot to master at least 1 Swiss national language. As PhD student courses were free, hope you profited from this opportunity.

Back to job fairs, I found my job 6 years ago at ETH's Polymesse. The 2022 event was 3 weeks ago, next one 2023. Take a look at the calendar for other job fairs and networking events https://ethz.ch/students/en/careers/...en_Messen.html

The other big job fair is at EPFL next October 2022. Big companies even have dedicated programs for recent graduates https://www.forum-epfl.ch/en/

Now a bit of how hiring works at the engineering company I work. First, for recent graduates without a long CV full of good references, forget about an unlimited contract. The attainable goal is a 6 month internship. Why? It's because management does not want to invest resources in an uncertain hire. So far at my job, 2 internships have become unlimited contracts because the hiring manager has arguments to present to higher management on why create a new permanent position. In other words, every new hire has to be sold to higher management. If great CV the hiring manager has all what's needed to sell you there's chance you get an unlimited contract offer right away. If not, there's a 6 month grind but good chances to land a contract at the end of the internship.

14
Apply for a postdoc position in one of big pharmas in Basel.

15

Thanks a lot. I am also looking for internships as well.

And yes, I am going to EPFL life science career event in May.

But, I do have quite good CV and background, it is all about the first step in industry which is not easy.

Regarding the language, I speak A2 German and hopefully for summer I will be on B1 level.

16
Do you have an idea of what you'd like to actually do? Clinical trials coordinator? Product development? Sales? And would you consider startups in addition to the large companies?

17
That is where I apply, also a project management, also research scientist, also consulting. The only thing I don't want to do is wet lab work and more paper-related things with people.

18
great. I forgot another job website https://www.acad.jobs/

So, apply for jobs. Worst thing can happen is they don't even bother to answer.

I started my PhD at 30 YO, do the math of when I transitioned from academia to industry . My current groupleiter did his PhD, postdoc and had 2 assistant professor positions before going into consulting at the tender age of 41.

PS. unrequested commentary about academia. Lots of PhD graduates have not good mental health at graduation time. Maybe, they had the problems even before starting the program, who knows?. The point is a lot of graduates want to do something else in their lives far away from PhD subject. Things some ex-colleagues did after PhD as main jobs: applying to music school as student, working with children with learning difficulties, high-school chemistry teacher. As pretentious armchair expert, I'd venture that my ex-colleagues and your friends that got stuck as technicians after postdoc had burnouts. Some of the people I've met returned to work on Earth science after 2-3 years, but not all of them. My hypothesis is that the transition from academia to industry is not blocked by industry because we need workers. The answer might be untreated mental health issues.

19
I did my phd in the US. After graduation I worked for a large company in a more or less unrelated field for a few years, I now work for for a startup in CH.

Why do you say it is mission impossible? You apply and they say no?

You look at the requirements/skills and you dont have them or they simply dont even acknowledge your application?

If it is the first then apply to more places and work on your job talk and interview skills. Out of grad school I applied to 12 jobs and was offered 1. When we moved to CH I applied to 7 and got 3. You get better at these things.

If it is the second I would suggest to take a step back and think about what industries actually care about the skillset you have. Talk to people in your contact network about where people get hired. There are a fair number of RnD heavy companies in Europe, many of which with presence in CH.

That brings me to the Switzerland constraint.. As a phd the total number of relevant industry positions is not particularly large and CH is _tiny_. It might well be that the 3 companies in CH relevant to you are not hiring at this particular moment for random reason. It would be easier if you were prepared to look further afield.

Look at startups as well as established companies. "Deep tech" is all the vogue now. Lots are startups are doing heavy and interesting RnD. They need researchers.

In my experience you are completely wrong about the postdoc thing. It's fine to not want to do a postdoc (I didnt). But I have never heard about a case where it hurt. Several (10+) of the people in my contact network did postdocs and then industry. Including 2 in my current company.

Anecdotally the phd to industry transition seems to be harder in Europe than in the US overall. Companies here seem less likely to hire people based on general scientific/technical/problem-solving skills. Rather they want someone who has already studied the exact task they are interested in for the past 4 years. (And a good phd student almost by definition has not been working on a problem of immediate interest to a large company).

Probably this is why most technological progress happens in the US rather than Europe these days xp.