Investment Funds for Future

Finance, Taxes, Banking, Insurance and Retirement
21
Hello @swisspea, @Jim2007

Thank you for your answers.

Let me clarify my perspective. I have an initial sum of 10,000 CHF, and I plan to add an extra 300 CHF each month, which amounts to 36,000 CHF over 10 years, starting from 2024.

My goal is to make wise investment decisions without relying on gambling. I believe that by considering the long term, I can take calculated risks.

By the end of 20 years, I would like to see my investment reach around 1 million CHF. While this may seem like a significant increase, I believe it is achievable through careful investment choices.

I am particularly interested in new technologies such as clean energ, AI, etc. as they are rapidly growing fields. These sectors might offer more opportunities for achieving my financial goals. However, I acknowledge that luck does play a role, but I want to base my decisions on informed insights.

I hope this clarifies my perspective, and I'm seeking new information, perspectives, and investment suggestions to help me make well-informed decisions. Thank you

22
Yes, that's totally realistic.

23
You‘ve been given plenty of sensible and realistic advice on this thread, but you seem intent on ignoring it.

What makes you think that you can be one of the greatest investment geniuses of all time? Because that is essentially what you are saying by wanting to turn 46k into 1m.

More to the point if you think you can do this. Why don‘t you borrow 100k and add it to your pot and turn it into 10m. If you did that and waited 40 years, you‘d be a billionaire by your maths.

You mention wanting to invest and not gamble in one sentence then you tell us you want a ridiculous return on your money. The 7% or so return you‘ve found for VT is what you should be looking for if you are investing (in equities) and has been repeatedly said, looking to keep your management and transaction costs as low as possible.

My guess is that you‘re looking at the increase in price of Bitcoin from its launch to peak and think that this is normal. It isn‘t!

24
You keep using phrases like "low risk", "careful investment choices", "calculated risks" and so on, but at each stage you demonstrate the exact opposite.

So far, your informed decision making has produced:

- A very high risk portfolio where 60% of it's value is based on speculation, fear and greed

- A funds list generated via AI, which you believed contained comparable funds

- A very basic article you decided was "a great article"

- And now an expectation that you can turn 10k into 1m in 20 years

Given that the general consensus is that that a well balanced portfolio should return about 6% - 8%, you are talking about achieving an annualised return of about 27%, that is about 7% higher than Buffet, 11% higher than Schloss and twice what I achieved over 35 years and doing it on very limited experience.

As for technology, if you were around in the early 80s like I was, you'd have been back backing OS/2 or maybe Linux, with Windows very much in 3rd place, like all the techie investors of the time. But it was not about technology, it was about business experience and Gates had the edge because as well as the tech he had a father who was a very skilled lawyer and business man in the background and that gave him the edge.

I know from experience that you will do what you are going to do no matter what you hear from us, because all you are really looking for is validation of your intentions. You are no different to, I don't know, maybe 20% of the people I have met over the past 35 years. So good luck, I hope for your daughters sake it works out for you.

25
My wife ( Swiss) ...who works in Zurich in investment banking in Zurich ...and in contrast to most of the punters she deals with is pretty risk shy. She holds in her personal account a hefty wodge of Fundsmith.

Haven’t got a clue personally how risky that is or not ( I am just a simple craftsman) but her returns since the beginning are more than 400%.

26
Open any compound calculator and you will see that this means an average yearly return of 20%, not sure if you are serious of just trolling at this point

27
Of course it’s hard to say, but I have met a lot of people like the OP.... The common factor is that most of them will have read articles written by people who have got something to sell - books, courses, tools, newsletters and data. In fact if you want to make sure money in investing that is the way to go! The Fool did not start making real money until it started peddling newsletters [and inventing their own way of doing performance calculations].

And the required annualized return rate for the OPs objective is a little over 27%, performance and attribution calculations are actually fairly complex. Some people make a career out of it. If you are good at it Asset Managers will be willing to pay handsomely for your services.

28
Fundsmith is a very well managed fund, but I can’t comment on the return as it is specific to you. This is also something people have to understand - your actual return will differ from the fund and other investors because the size and timing of the inflow (not to be confused with timing the market) impacts the annualized return.

29

That's something I'd like to know more about. Is there a way, any data to look at or ask for, to understand how my investment in a particular fund is going to perform?

30
yup, the return will generally be the price you sell at less the price you bought at. so still important to buy low and sell high.

or to put it anothe way: don't panic sell when fund value goes down and don't FOMO and buy in when the fund valuation is high or in the news for some reason.

31
No. You can look at how the fund has performed over certain periods in the past and you can set up some spreadsheets and do some what if type analysis of your own to make projections. And you can use performance and attribution techniques to explain how you got to where you are.

In terms of strategy, a dollar cost averaging approach will probably give you a good result.

32
(if I did not misunderstand what the original message was about) the thing is that, in practice, an average investor in the fund makes less money than the average fund return on paper - because when the fund is doing well it has less money in it then when it is doing poorly. The reason is that people are emotional and try to time the market, and they actually perform - on average - worse than what a monkey would do by randomly buying/selling a fund.

As others mentioned, do dollar-cost averaging, buy-and-hold even when there is yet another panic, do the balancing (so effectively buy more of what's going poorly and buy less of what's going well) - and you will get the best out of your fund and more than an average investor

33
Thank you for all of your answers and guidance.

A friend of mine has suggested me a different investment opportunity, which I have decided to pursue.

Thank you a lot again.

34
It's even worse than that. Short term oriented people typically buy on the way up and at the top and on the first steps down, they hold on the way down, and only sell after their money has disappeared. ARKK is an excellent example case.

35
Lovely... After a bunch of people took a loooooot of time to give you advice, would you care to share yours? Or is it a secret opportunity that cannot be shared?

I call troll...

36
It's not like that at all! I just thought it wasn't worth mentioning I really appreciate the advice everyone has given me.

First of all, let me clarify that I don't have any secret investment model in mind.

My goal is actually quite simple: I want to do something good for my daughter's future. So I've decided to invest in buying a flat.

Currently, I'm looking for different mortgage options and gathering information.

that's all.

It may not be a great investment, but I can benefit from it too

37
A real question.

Two years ago I bought some shares in Appen. I am currently running a book loss of over 80%. Do I hold on and wait for the long term or get out now?

38
Only you can answer that question! Is the reason you bought them still valid or do you need to raise funds?

39

Ok, for a moment I thought that there's some secret, like different category of shares depending on when you bought it

I have my 3rd pillar at VIAC, currently idling as I pulled out from the funds last summer when all started falling down. I kind of forgot about it, but it's time to check the situation again, maybe return to allocating in investment

40
you shifted to cash? did that actually work out better than doing nothing (assuming yo buy back in today)?