Smokers Vs Non-smokers

Daily Life, Swiss News and General Topics
41
Given that you have a 1:4 chance of getting cancer, you have to multiply the added risks, so it isn't just taken in isolation.

The other thing to remember is that lung cancer mortality is high as it is often picked up late, e.g. vs. breast cancer and hard to treat.

But, as I said, as they die on average 10-15 years younger (depending on the source) than non-smokers, I am happy for smokers to keep lighting up and reduce some of the financial burden.

Psst: I think he is questioning the passive smoking link rather than active. And, to be fair, this is not strong.

On another note, what passive smoking does do is kick off other people's allergies/asthma type conditions. While this is not necessarily life-threatening, it is a concrete effect that smokers have on non-smokers and can have serious morbidity consequences.

42
I think the stupidity comes from ones inabilty to grasp, in their hatred of smokers, the concept of the point being discussed. PASSIVE SMOKING.

No doubt smoking to an individual who actually smokes themselves can have adverse affects as I freely admit, but which of course is the own individuals choice. Russian roulette you could say.

43
Depends on whether you are using a revolver or pistol, surely...

44
Heard there was a guy that tried it with a semi-automatic pistol. Darwin Awards or something like that...

45
In my mind, you can smoke if you want to. But please try to smoke down-wind or away from the non-smokers. Please don't smoke around kids. And please take care of your cigarette butts - they are garbage and should be disposed of properly (the ground is not a garbage). I've only met one smoker who conscientiously put out his butts, and then put them in a garbage, every time.

For all in the heated debate, the more you try to prove to a smoker that their choice is bad for them, the more you invite them to think of reasons why their smoking is not a problem, thus fortifying their position. They won't change (just like we won't) until they are ready and for their own reasons.

46
When you've finished your ciggy do you dispose of it properly, or do you just throw it on the ground?

Just curious.

47
No, I won't nor do I have to "trust" you... but, you clearly are the more educated person. You have spent so much time, energy, and effort into proving how right you want to be (note, I didn't say "are")... frankly... I could care less...

funny how you are even smarter than cancer.org... a non-profit organization based on education, intellectuals, and people MUCH smarter than me (note, I didn't say smarter than you)....

and what is it your PhD is in again? Oh yes... Smoking

48
Eugh, im finding some ofthe comments here infuriating....

Even when i smoked id never come out with some of the dribble that was said here...

As for the people who have an "occasional" smoke with a drink your fooling yourself if you think your not addicted and your fooling yourself if you think you enjoy it.

When you have the drink you crave the smoke to go with it. Telling yourself its enjoyable and its only 1 is your addiction making a fool of you.

And to the "full time" smokers who say its enjoyable, relieves stress, aids relaxation etc... If you had the opportunity to go back in time and tell yourself not to light that first smoke... would you do it? If you knew then what you know now... would you still want to be a smoker?

In some ways smoking is worse than herion. Every cigarette is a "hit" every pull on the smoke is a "hit" you probably need 100 hits a day at least!

From my point of view nicotine is the big bad wolf. If you could inject nicotine it would kill you straight away.

When you take that first puff and you cough, feel light headed.. feel a little sick etc it is because you are giiving your body a poison and these different reactions is how your body tells you NO.

BUT still we persist on through the coughing and ill health.... enough to actually addict ourselfs to poison. Congratulations! You are successfully killing yourself!!

Ive heard people use examples of a man who lives to a fine age and smoked all their lifes. Usually forgetting that the last 10 years was speant with ill health or the fact that they could have lived 10 years longer.

Also, worth noting that a smoke cannot relieve stress or aid relaxation. Smoking inreases your heart rate... therefore it cannot aid relaxation and makes you moore stressed! Any stress reliief you feel is related to getting the hit of nicotine!

All that said I pity the smoker. I do honestly understand. I know with the way society is "enjoying" your smoke is quite hard. The dirty looks... and the abuse. Some consideration from the non smoker is required. I honestly believe if smokers had a do over 99% wouldnt smoke today. I dont think we should demand smokers to stub it out because we are around (except pregnant ladies etc..) Reasonable consideration from both sides is required. BUT please stop with the lame excuses for smoking.

49
I know.. but, you can only talk to a wall long enough before you realize, the wall is without reason and will not talk back... this is clearly a case of feeding the troll[s]

I would say, that poor dead goat probably had enough common sense to know that smoking and cancer are directly linked... and he lived a much better life

....

Even if you take death out of the equation... Here is a question for the smokers...

Being honest with yourself, how often do you get a cold? And, when you get a cold, how easy is it for you to shake the cold? And, while having that cold, how nasty is the coughing, etc.?

I get a cold about once every 5 years, maybe a little less often, I honestly don't keep track. And when I get a cold, it usually lasts about a week, with no major symptoms.

The irony is... I am not in great physical condition, but I do try my best to hope for a healthy life and lifestyle..

I don't know one person that smokes who doesn't get the most disgusting sounding, deep in the chest colds all the time... and I don't feel a bit sorry for them.

Remember that other post about slapping our children? In the early parts of the thread I mentioned how my father was. He, has always been a heavy smoker. In the recent years, he had to have his foot, then lower leg, then entire right leg, then entire left leg amputated because he lost circulation due to smoking. It wasn't a theory. It wasn't a quack doctor just trying to find a cause. It was based on many medical tests and fact. Now, that moron (yes, he is) still smokes...

50
Haha Chill, jeez you really are passionate about your cause for someone who could not care less.

You're missing the point, I am not claiming to be smarter than anyone, that's your drivel, I am merely stating I have read all the studies in their entirety at some point or another rather than listen to misinformation. Sadly a lot of people take what they are told for granted, swayed by the important sounding person that presented it, or the trust they would have in that organisation that would obviously not have another agenda but your very welfare.

I know i am right about passive smoking because the facts are there for you to read. Go read them, the actual studies, not the sites presenting data for their argument. A phd has nothing to do with the ability to read and interpret data. I am not person who is impressed by titles, letters, or opinions. Just the facts as they are detailed for all to see. My only exception to that rule is the realm of conspiracy theories of ancient history and the unexplained where the facts aren't known, and thus the mind can wonder.

51
Thanks, but you don't need to waste time pitying a smoker. Although I appreciate the sentiment. I speak for myself of course!

As for most of your post, i am not sure anyone has even said the majority of what you are saying, so i believe It's what you are second guessing based on the cliche's.

52
You forget, your previous comment started out claiming you've read ten times more than me on the subject... You don't think that warrants a defense on my part? I do! And yes, you implied right out of the gate you are smarter and know more with this sort of info.

No, I'm really not smarter nor care to be. I know that your smoking infringes on my right to clean air anytime you smoke where I stand. I am not going to take more time debating the facts of second hand smoke, but I'll tell you, it is, IMHO, flat out inconsiderate of you and any other smoker to impose your habit on me.

Take it to the extreme. Suppose I liked to spit. While waiting for the bus I spit everywhere I stood, in front of you around you, etc. first, I doubt you would like the hocking noise all that much, but also, at some point you would have to step in my spit. Is that right? Should I spit where you stand? And, as this all started off, if I get there before you, should I give a S* about you not liking my spit?

It's silliness and we both now it.

Yes, I like to debate when something needs clarity and when I think something is flat out wrong. It's not the best quality I have I know, but it is me.

53
What do you call one cigarette a month?

54
Still going at it, I see?

Second hand smoke is "the" subject ....... to distract Joe-public from the 36% of children with Thyroid tumours in the after-effects of the Fukushima disaster? The fact that all around us there is low-grade radiation?

We turn on each other like cornered rats - while we continue to buy up and use electrricity consuming gadgets ..... with thoughts of the future provision of this electricity ...... where is it to come from?

On the subject of cancer. Can anyone here enlighten me as to howcome it seems that only those with property/money receive intensive Chemotherapy treatments ?(that eventually killed them anyway) - and - of the 3 people I know who have died these horrible cancer deaths, the treatment they received was extolled as "something new and not yet used on humans" - and was SO expensive it bent the mind to even consider.

And by the way, as related to this thread, none of those 3 (make it 4 - someone I knew a few years back also succumbed, after their coffers were emptied) - none of them were ever smokers?

55
Yay! Flame war!

56
Erm, well yes because you asked me to do some light reading??? Do you forget what you write which will inevitably get said response when one has read far more than the average person direct from the source of the science

As for the implication I would argue that's evident don't you. Again, source vs hear say or shall we say public agenda.

Your right to clean air as you put it, is equal to my right to smoke outside. The passive smoke is just more easily smelt and seen compared to other substances in the air.

Spitting wouldn't bother me if that's what you want to do. I don't make a habit of licking the soles of my shoes. There are far worse things on the floor we walk.

Silliness perhaps, but I reference you to my first post, I said the debate would rage on as a smoker and a non smoker would never agree. Never said I wouldn't indulge it

57
and to which I quickly replied it is clear you are trying to evoke an argument more than a point... which is fine and dandy...

enjoy your smoke breaks today

58
Oh no not at all, I just like to educate on this massive public misconception. It's not healthy for people to live in fear of something they should not. They are completely entitled to be bothered by it, we all have our annoyances as I pointed out before, but berating smokers on health grounds under the passive smoke banner is flawed.

Muchas Gracias

59
The perennial question to smokers has to be: Why do you smoke?

60
Most of the Swiss government seem to be in favour of passive smoking. There will be a vote on the passive smoking referendum on 23rd September,

http://www.parlament.ch/d/wahlen-abstimmungen/volksabstimmungen/volksabstimmungen-2012/abstimmung-2012-09-23/passivrauchen/seiten/default.aspx

How times have changed... quote: "Blow smoke in her face and she'll follow you anywhere.."

http://www.en-derin.com/artworks/cigarette-advertising-a-vintage-look

more, http://www.google.de/search?num=10&h...ac.ucuAI74sT9E

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