Standard of English teaching in Swiss schools

I see.

The language of cads also.

And football hooligans. Don't forget the football hooligans. They don't like being ignored and might threaten to 'push yer face in'.

...and hoodies and.. and ..and..

I'm curious, how do Americans pronounce calcium, barium, sodium, cadmium, for example? Calcum, barum, sod 'em , cadmum?

We do spell those with the i in them, we pronounce them (more or less) the same as you.

HTH

Although the "sod'em" could be done anyhow...

Making my search for an open English position even more challenging (and a bit depressing). Granted, I am more interested in teaching an English rhetoric/literature/composition course than I am interesting in teaching an English as an Additional Language course (at least to beginners), but still. If I could work with students at the gymnasium levels, which would be in line with the student population I taught in America, there would be no misunderstanding flappy for floppy and I'd be a happy camper.

I moved here to Zurich this past summer (as a permanent move after marrying), and I naively/ignorantly/cluelessly had no idea it would be so hard to find a full-time teaching position. Just assumed with all the international schools that it would be a piece of cake. In my defense, I come from a state with high schools 3,000-4,000 strong with teenagers. Lots of kids means lots of staff needed to teach them.

I'm surprised the Swiss schools aren't stuffed with perfectly fluent English teachers (for English language courses) given all the to-do made about the perfection of Swiss education (from the outside looking in).

Your gripe is enlightening—thank you!

My daughter was born in Bern and lived here in a dual speaking household, went to a Swiss state school and finished at age 15 with the standard Swiss school leaving certificate. She then went to Bournemouth UK, one of two UK towns which are full of "English as a foreign language" schools (The other is Brighton). A town where I assumed they would be sympathetic to language education.

She studied 2 years in Bournemouth at a large state comprehensive school and took GCSE examinations in 10 subjects. She had super results, but the big surprise was she was the ONLY candidate taking French and German exams. She passed both with flying colours, despite not having had any language lessons for two years.

Public schools try to hire teachers who can teach more than one subject. From middle school onwards, the English taught is usually geared towards Cambridge exams, leaving very little opportunity for students to take the kind of courses you would like to offer.

It would depend on country and context. In American-English, "I did write to her" would be used, really, only for emphasis:

Did you write your thank you note to Grandma?

--Yeah, I wrote it yesterday.

Then why is there still a full book of stamps on the table?

--Ugh! I did write the note, just like I said! I didn't say that I mailed it!

I am not surprised at all. When the start of English teaching was put "down" few teachers had a decent English language education. You mention that "English teacher" but in reality most likely is a teacher also teaching English beside half a dozen of fields. I am afraid to guess that the situation countrywide is not better than what you got here

According to the Cambridge chaps, you need the Cambridge Proficiency to act as a teacher for English. But few teachers have this, not even the "Lower"

Primary and middle school teachers must have the CAE, the Cambridge Advanced Exam, in order to teach English at school. Because there is no expiry date on the certificate, most teachers have a hard time maintaining the CAE level. It's a natural process that would happen to most of us.

My own bilingual daughter who is also currently at collège rarely gets a 6 at English and I wonder if such a thing is possible. I have one of her essays in front of me, I won't post it but she lost a mark for each of the following.

"Even though to us it would already be obvious" ('to us' should be at the end)

"For example at page 62" (on page 62)

"He has difficulty understanding" (in understanding)

"People with Asperger's Syndrome have difficulty associating actions.." (difficulties not difficulty)

"We can see that people with this disorder" (that disorder)

"They need help associating actions with.." (help to associate)

"In order to know how someone is feeling" (someone feels)

"To help them feel" (them to feel)

I'm losing faith in my own diminishing ability to speak English.

I'm sure that in England a teacher would have just glanced over those mistakes, if indeed mistakes they are.

I think it was revenge for chuckling in class at her teacher's pronunciation.

One of my sons (I have two, only one of them took english as a 'second' language at school), was told that he'd never, ever get a 6 in English as he had an unfair advantage over the other children in his class; ie, he had anglophone parents.

I did try to argue that other students were taking german as a second language with a similar advantage and the teacher thought that was hilarious as an argument.

I was eventually reduced to the petty revenge of returning all her class assignments corrected with a red pen. Taking particular glee in the fact that she was teaching american english but didn't realise it.

Since I don't know if English is your mother tongue and which side of the Atlantic you hail from, it's hard to gauge the native-ness of these mistakes but I will say the instructor must be native, or near enough, and your daughter is being taught by a reasonably competent person. I'll explain some of the mistakes below:

"Even though to us it would already be obvious" ('to us' should be at the end)

Awkward use of a prepositional phrase. Though one could say this is niggling, a strict grammarian could explain it in more detail.

"For example at page 62" (on page 62)

Prepositional phrases are the bane of those coming to English as a non-native. There are no rules or, rather, what rules there are don't help much in the way of choosing the right preposition for the job. "On" in this context is correct whereas "at" is not. I forget the old example of "The train arrives in Tours at 4.30 on platform 49." This part of English is a bitch to learn.

"He has difficulty understanding" (in understanding)

Need more context as to why the person grading felt the need to make a prepositional phrase out of this one.

"People with Asperger's Syndrome have difficulty associating actions.." (difficulties not difficulty)

Most likely this one is due to making 'difficulty' agree with the plural 'actions'.

"We can see that people with this disorder" (that disorder)

Again, more context is needed since it's likely the pronoun was changed for agreement with what followed. Pronouns are also a bitch in English. Whomever is grading these is on the ball.

"They need help associating actions with.." (help to associate)

Another insertion of a prepositional phrase likely because of what follows in the sentence. It also sounds better just from the short snippet.

"In order to know how someone is feeling" (someone feels)

Acceptable in spoken English, it's also a very American English phrase (is feeling).

"To help them feel" (them to feel)

Another insertion of a prepositional phrase likely because of what follows in the sentence.

Overall, I'd say the instructor and/or the exam grader is tough and on the ball, hitting the most common difficult spots for non-native speakers of English. I'm sure the chuckling didn't help in terms of getting the hardass grading treatment.

I would challenge the instructor on all of these changes except for "at" to "on" for page references (although nearly all of my law school professors used "at"), and see what they offer as support. the first sentence, for example, is merely missing 2 commas ("even though, to us, it would already be obvious"), and the use of the infinitive (including the "to") is not grammatically incorrect but it is horribly stilted unless what was written was the entire sentence. likewise, the "in" before "understanding" only makes sense if "understanding" is intended as a noun, e.g. "He has difficult in understanding." is right, but "He has difficult in understanding math." would be wrong.

btw, the use of "difficulties" instead of "difficulty" would have sent me through the roof.

This thread makes me think of a situation when my eldest called me from Phoenix when he started his year as an exchange student in high school. He took German as a foreign language and told me pretty horrified that he couldn't understand a word his teacher was telling in class. Her grammar was non existent, her spelling atrocious and her accent a joke (his words not mine). Luckily for him he could change subject an went over to Spanish.

Same problem, other country

To have it with Freiherr von Goethe die Worte hör ich wohl, allein, mir fehlt der Glaube

English please?