Unfortunately for me I did read your posts and try and help. Sorry it you feel they don’t, but the options I laid out are it, whether you like them or not.
I’d like to know what conflicting advice you were given about changing jobs on an L permit, because the rules are quite clear. Admittedly, not all people in offices dealing with migration issues do know the rules when they should, but I would think that’s one of the ones that everyone will know. Non-EU L permits are not granted that easily so I would expect people dealing with these issues to know pretty much everything about their restrictions. I also suspect it would have been stated in the letter/document you got with your permit, these things usually are.
If you’re that unhappy then take one of those other jobs abroad if you don’t want to stay where you are or risk not getting a new permit. You and your girlfriend can visit back and forth so you won’t be apart that much until you marry, and if the relationship can’t stand a little long distance romance for a while it’s not strong enough for marriage in the first place.
I read something recently, albeit not in an official document so could be as good as "someone down the pub told me", that a tied L permit is valid up to one year and can be extended to two years. After that "if you stay with your current employer" they must give you a (tied) B permit. This to me certainly implies that one can change employer from a tied L permit. Having said that, things change so it could be completely wrong. Do what the others say - ask the new employer to apply for work permission.
Why would you think that? A tied L becomes a tied B - still with the same employer, although getting permission to change employers is a bit easier with a tied B as opposed to an L. And L permits can usually only be extended for 1 more year, not 2, although several posters here on the forum have said they’ve been on an L permit for 3/4 years.
Is this a response to my post? I would think that otherwise the words "if you stay with your current employer" would not be needed. I don't know why it would be easier to switch from a B than an L. Extended *to* two years means two years in total, i.e. extended *by* one year.
Right. Even Switzerland is not an ideal place, and there is absolutely no guarantee that every law has to make sense to everyone.
That being said, you shouldn't rely on a statement unless you see it printed in a law. The speculations on whether your current employer will be contacted by the AWA in this thread weren't followed by a reference to a law, so I would take them still as speculations unless someone can indeed point out to an explicit place in the Swiss law (most of them are actually freely available on the net).
But again, that point may not be your only concern. Another big concern is to be whether the new employer can indeed get a new permit for you.
You are complaining about the Swiss immigration/working laws and you perceive them as unreasonably harsh, maybe even inhumane. I have a full appreciation of that position. Seen in a wider context however, one may try to understand it. It may even be argued that such harsh laws reflect a certain kind of supply/demand equilibrium. The standard of living and in particular the salary levels are absolutely superior in comparison with surrounding countries. The harsh entry conditions may thus be seen as the "price" for that (in some strange implicit sense). To put it bluntly: one may work in Germany for X CHF and enjoy slightly looser immigration laws, or work here for say 3X CHF and suffer from tougher laws.
Sounds very reasonable. There was a tendency in this thread to picture an employer who managed to obtain an L permit as a little God. There has been only little justification for that. What they actually have to pay by the law is 400CHF, peanuts for any reasonable company, and that is specifically paid for the administrative costs, that is, for the processing of the application by the authorities. The mentioned costs of a higher order of magnitude are the costs that the company may pay if they hire an external lawyer to deal with the application. Those can indeed grow to around 5000CHF, BUT only for small companies that hire an external lawyer. Larger companies have their own legal experts within the HR and due to the economy of scales can dramatically lower the costs per application. These costs whatever they are are fully compensated in two ways: (1) it is not uncommon that the company contractually requires from the employee holding an L-permit to reimburse the costs, should they leave the company too early; (2) the costs in most cases generously underestimate the underpayment premium that non-EU rocket science specialists are commonly subjected to in comparison with the Inländer. So yes, please refrain from using these costs as a justification for whatever additional rights that have employer may have (in reality: non-existent). Whatever moral framework you may assume in such considerations, it just does not match the simple arithmetic.
Nicely said
Good comment above on the X vs 3X tradeoff when encountering the tough regime. Thats the way it is.
A big thank you to Medea and other contributors for the valuable information you have shared.
I have a follow-up questions.
1. Given that the priority for any job in Switzerland is given to Swiss nationals, EU nationals, and foreign nationals with a longterm resident permit or a resident permit allowing employment, wouldn't a L-permit holder fall into the priority category? The implication is that in case the L-permit holder wants to change jobs, the next employer would not have to go though the process involved in hiring non-EU individuals as the L-permit holder would be considered a part of the existing labor force by virtue of her work-permit. The same would be true for a B-permit holder if her permit is still 'tied' to her employer. Does this argument hold water?
I understand that a job change for an L-permit holder is authorized only in rare circumstances. I am just thinking from the perspective of a prospective employer who is willing to apply for a new work permit and if they will have to go through the process that is involved for hiring Non-EU nationals or if they will get an exemption.
Thank you in advance.
This may be like beating a dead horse, but any inputs on the above would be greatly appreciated!
Hi ICeBlended,
The forum is eager to know what was the outcome of your struggle with 12 months rule . Did your new employer manage to get a way around ?
Here , people are forced to be out of Switzerland even after having a B closed permit ( 2 years on L and 1 year on B ) and having a specialist job offer on a new contract , new company ...
This is a stupid rule targeted at non EUs ..non EUs ( especially third States) are just not welcome in Switzerland .
Well, you knew that this was the status quo when you came here? There are some regulations on "freedom of movement" for EU people and that counts. You may not like it but it is as it is.
And ever thought of trying to get a work permit for the US? Not easy either, or?
Wondering if anyone had any insights to share on my post (quoted below)?
No , everyone including the HR folks are under impression that once you get a tied B Non EU , the other employer can get the work authorization and one need not repeat the whole process . The rule on B permit (12 months out ) came into effect this Jan only , otherwise there were several instances. In fact the letter accompanying the B permit explicitly states that change in employer is possible , but when you call the awa ,different people say different things .
I can imagine the amount of frustration and agony one has to go through after a PhD job paying same as swiss ,out of slavery .
The guy IceBlended was actually a slave in his previous company ( or he still is if hes has not left ) because if the employer kind of takes things for granted and exploits because they know they cannot leave and if they leave no matter how good the candidate is , a new permit would make him comply to the 12 month out rule .. which virtually makes him a slave at the mercy of his current employer ( complete the whole 5 years till you get an Open B and then switch )
US is way way easier and transparent..
So if I understand this correctly:
Switching jobs while holding an L or tied B permit: The new employer does not have to prove to the authorities that they could not find anyone else in Switzerland or EU. However, the candidate has to exit Switzerland and remain outside the country for 12 months before she can take up the new job.
Switching jobs while holding an open B permit: The new employer does not have to prove to the authorities that they could not find anyone else in Switzerland or EU. The candidate does not have to exit Switzerland.
Is the above understanding accurate?
Thanks in advance.
for # 1 , understanding is incorrect , labor market test is absolutely necessary and for non EU , before they take the new job they have to sit out for 12 months out of Switzerland( yes even after the labor market test )
for # 2 , for open B , one can switch jobs only if he holds a EU passport . and the Next employer again has to pass the labor market test .
What about open B for non-EU? Can't non-EU switch jobs on an open-B permit?
Or do you mean to say that a non-EU candidate, whether she is on L, B or Open B permit, has to exit Switzerland for 12 months before switching jobs?
Thanks in advance.
Sorry kunalsingh, I’m away at the moment so did not see your posts. When you’re speaking of Swiss, EU nationals and others who already live here you’re talking of people who hold either C or (open) B permits. Tied L or B permits are not the same and have the restrictions mentioned regarding changing employers. A non-EU national on an L permit cannot change jobs; a non-EU national on a tied B permit will find it EXTREMELY difficult to get permission to change jobs. Only a non-EU national with an open B permit can change jobs without any problems - they are at that point effectively like an EU national as far as work goes. They can change jobs without needing permission and can live wherever they want to in Switzerland.