Switzerland fertility falls to record low

Yep. There is a very educational movie about that, already 20 years old:

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808

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Darwinism forged humans over a long time span. We are so successful because we are genetically and culturally diverse. For whatever reasons, a wide span of ā€œintelligenceā€ seems to have ensured survival. Who do you prefer, Forrest Gump or Elon Musk?

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The question is more Trump or Camacho:
https://www.imdb.com/video/vi757974041

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That’s how it works with recessive genes. Nothing happens in one generation and then…voilĆ !

It has little to do with recessive genes. What are Dominant and Recessive?
Human societies thrive when a variety of genetic characteristics are present. Gene duplication enables individuals to hedge their bets. It is difficult to predict what will be a positive in the future but more Elon genes or more Donny genes does not look good. And those two have large families :upside_down_face:

Naturally, this forum is full of ā€˜foreigners’ to Switzerland, so your comment is a real head scratcher.

Anyway, I’m expecting my first child in September. Between the marriage tax (though recently repealed via vote) and the vast expense of non-subsidized childcare, Switzerland clearly DOES NOT support Swiss people having children. It’s clear policy, and the lack of formal government support for parents demonstrates that the population supports the antinatalist policy.

I’d say it is more that it doesn’t support familiies with 2 working parents. I think there is quite a drive for traditional family unit with one parent at home looking after the kids full time.

Socially, I’ve seen it frowned upon when mothers do not give up their jobs to look after their kids full time. It was here I that learned the term ā€œRabenmutterā€ (literally ā€œraven motherā€) - a derogatory German term for a mother who supposedly neglects her children or prioritizes her own needs (often career) over those of her family. The term is an insult that particularly targets working mothers. It is based on the misconception that ravens do not care for their young, even though they are very attentive.

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You hear that term often in more rural areas, especially in farming villages ond/or communities that are more on the conservative spectrum.

I’m actually all for the traditional family unit. From what I’ve seen, having 2 parents working just moves the goal posts. Yes, you have increased family income, but if everybody does the same, then the prices of everything just goes up so that you are in no better position e.g. in the UK, you almost ā€˜need’ to be a working 2 parent family to afford to buy a house in the cachement area of a good school.

If child-care was subsidised our taxes would have to increase. And, I believe, the actual problem with child-care in Switzerland is not (just) the cost but the availability of adequate facilities. Certainly the priority should be to ensure that adequate space is available rather than the costs. Economics 101 if the supply increases then demand and the ability to charge monopolistic rents declines.

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This.

Everybody loves moving to Switzerland because of the attractive taxes but then don’t think the equation through far enough.

Services such as childcare have to be paid for somehow if not through taxes.

Childcare is subsidised from the public purse in certain circumstances where the combined household wage is low, so there is help available.

To be fair, we get it in the neck whatever we do. If we don’t work then we’re ā€œwasting a good education and not contributing to the public purseā€ and if we do work then we’re bad mothers. Meh.

None of that is exclusive to Switzerland.

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Obviously, the answer is to not go to school and marry young and start churning out babies :wink:

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And say your prayers to Jesus, or simply be an American conservative.

Actually we spend a lot on education and have probably the best public education in the world. And the most expensive too…

In Spain for example the government dictates what children have to learn at school and that obviously changes every time another party wins elections. I do not want to even imagine what children will have to learn when the fascists win again as it looks like at the moment. Universities are more ā€œcenters of indoctrinationā€ then what they used to be. Even very low income parents have to pay a lot for school material, which is provided for free in Switzerland.

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Not necessarily. Who typically needs childcare: high-income dual working families. You attract them to your canton and you can more than make up for the cost with higher tax take.

I see this dynamic now in Basel Land vs Basel Stadt. BS has put a cap on childcare costs which can mean a few thousand of savings. Any dual-income household with kids would be drawn to locate in BS instead of BL.

Not only that, BS have poached a lot of the people working in BL Tagis as the new policy has created much more demand in BS vs BL.

BL is now struggling to find a policy response.

But, if you stay at home taking care of the children, don’t give them more than food and 10 mins of attention per day. Otherwise, you’d be an helicopter parent. Also, don’t drive anywhere (Elterntaxi), and don’t care too much about academic outcomes (Tiger mom).

People has as many opinions as dogs bark. There will always be an adjective, and this adjective tells more about the person speaking than the subject of conversation.

It seems the only constant here is that adults that fail to grow keep blaming their moms for everything until they die. Any adult over 30 YO that keeps blaming mothers…it’s a sign of intellectual disability.

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And what do low-income dual working families do with their kids when they are at work?

With low-income dual working, it would be more economical for the lower wage earner to quit and look after the kids given the cost of daycare (or have sufficient government subsidies).

The headline, that’s all you need to read.

The trend is clear: Population pyramid - Wikipedia
The question is, how do we deal with it or maybe just adapt to it?