13. AHV. Pension

100% This.

Conflating married women who don’t work with married women who have worked their whole working life as some sort of justification for receiving 50% of a pension is just an irrelevant argument.

It’s an outdated concept going back to when women mostly stayed at home.

4 Likes

Marton…you’re never short of anecdotes of a sort… :rofl:

1 Like

Preposterous argument. The 13th instalment will be an additional cost every year, so unless you stop inflation adjustment of pensions in the future, this is at best a one-off effect.

3 Likes

No. If thery were planning give us the 2% later you would be right. But AFAIK from statements made they are not. So it would be a long-term loss otherwise.

Swiss pension benefits in payment are adjusted every two years, 50% to prices and 50% to nominal earnings .
The old-age credits are calculated each year as a percentage of the co-ordinated salary. The latter is equal to the gross annual income minus the co-ordination deduction (CHF 25 095) but at most CHF 60 945.

Adjustment to inflation happens periodically, like every other year. However it’s a combination of inflation and average salary increase.

1 Like

Actually, when was the last increase in AHV? It was at least 5 years ago. Probably longer.

Indeed. And I don’t know why some here seem to conflate the two of them. ???

2 Likes

AHV pension is NOT social security. It has been payed for even in those cases where one of the spouses has some gaps in their working years. Social help is something totally different and yes, it has to be payed back. Frankly I don’t get why people seem to conflate the two of them. It is not a “social generosity” or call it what you like.
Edit: social generosity is only now, when the active population will pay this increase over the next years through raising taxes, AHV contributions and so on. But they voted for it…I guess everyone gets what they think they wanted in the end…

The same situation applies when existing pensions are increased due to inflation.

1 Like

Macroeconomics at play here. Think a bit harder. What is causing inflation - to begin with?

It is still the active population who pay.

The claim that people paid for their AHV pensions ignores the fact that that money is long gone, it was never put in a reserved account anywhere.

1 Like

@marton First - glad we agree on this one.
Second - same goes for any type of insurance, isn’t it.

Third: @Axa and others :wink:…to the rescue, please!! It seems our camp is running in circles here and you’re generally more patient than me…:slight_smile:

You are wrong. AHV is not “Sozialhilfe” but it is “social security” - it pays you out a certain amount for life depending on certain criteria BUT regardless of how much you actually paid in (unlike second pillar which is your own accumulated wealth). It also uses current income stream to pay out current population.

Social Security System | Kanton Zürich)%20as%20well.-,The%20Swiss%20social%20security%20system%20is%20divided%20into%20five%20different,Health%20and%20Accident%20Insurance%20(UV)

The Swiss social security system is divided into five different insurance schemes:
Old-Age and Survivor’s Insurance (AHV) and Disability Insurance (IV)
Health and Accident Insurance (UV)
Income Compensation Allowances in case of military service, maternity or paternity (starting 1.1.2021) (EO)
Unemployment Insurance (ALV)
Family Allowances

2 Likes

And don’t forget that the pensioners will also pay their own increase through an increase in VAT.

1 Like

I’m not patient. Money issues awake my inner little pyscho.

I guess this vote has motivated me to take taxes seriously. Life was easy because we don’t have to submit tax declaration due to canton Aargau regulations. All deducted directly from salary.

Times change, I will learn. Everyone looks after own interests, that’s the little monster my parents reared :smiley:

1 Like

And it’s taxed as income…

3 Likes

You’ll see when you’ll have to fill in your tax declaration…

@Buzzer , about the VAT increase - on the other thread I think it was marton who said nobody should be worried because they can’t raise the prices more than that, or something along this line. :slight_smile:

The annual 13th AHV payment is “peoples’ democracy pure” in action. Even a government which attempts some populist vote winning strategies, say proposing a Winter fuel allowance for pensioners or a relief scheme for ex. students forgiving their study related debts, will usually feel obliged to have some semblance of a plan to finance it. Not so with a peoples’ vote. It is indeed a wonder that the vote on raising the pension age was only rejected. The next vote could even be on reducing the pension age further and, while at it, the working week down to 32 or even 24 hours and maybe some extended paid child birth holidays for mother and father.

Incidentally, the 20 minutes newspaper had a lovely headline yesterday: “Generation-Clash: Rentner holen sich 13. AHV”

1 Like