I have found a few threads that *kind of* answer my question, but none that quite hit the spot and it would be useful to see if anyone has any insights in this area, before I speak to HR.
I will be going on maternity leave in August and am planning not to return to work thereafter, for a few reasons - 9 years with the same firm (and it was my first job from uni) and it seems like time for a career and company change and also a potential move back to the UK. I have been in my current role in Switzerland for 2 years.
I would like to be as up front as possible with my employer as I respect and like the people I work with and I don't want to mess them about. However, I also don't want to jeopardise my maternity leave.
So my question is: should I be up front with HR about my plans and then hand in my official notice once my maternity leave starts or could they hold me to something that I've said to them in meetings?
Let me know if you need any more details and thanks in advance for any help
As long as you give your resignation letter within the appropriate time frame (usually 2-3 months), my understanding is that you're not only within your rights to not return but your maternity leave will also be covered by the job...That means you could even give your 'notice' during the maternity leave, so long as it's given within the time frame
My wife did that, in fact her doctor signed her off as unable to work two months before the birth, so she got those two months plus the 14 weeks, and never returned to work.
First of all - huge congratulations to you and your OH!!!!! I wish I was there to tell you both in person and share a (non-alcoholic) good luck drink!
Secondly, I honestly don't know the answer to your question, but since we are in similar situations, except for the maternity portion of the story (many years with the same company and we like it), the way I would personally handle it (and I highlight "I") is: I would not mention to HR anything they don't need to know right this moment, i.e. as far as they are concerned, you're going on maternity leave, period.
However, I would speak "cards on the table", so to say, with my PM or direct boss. Again, I am thinking of the personal scenario - I respect and admire the fellow, and he has never let me down whenever I reached out to him for help, always made sure I was motivated, etc. so I would tell him that I am seriously considering not going back to work, both because of a potential move back, and also to potentially explore different career options. Someone here recently had a similar conversation - she loves her job, but wants to go back to school to get her master's degree, otherwise she will have serious career limitations (not having an advanced degree is a big deal for us for career progression, as you know). She was open about it with the big boss, saying look, if I get into grad school full time, I am quitting - and they told her we like you and your work, but good luck, keep us posted, meanwhile you're still part of the team. She happens to be someone who directly reports to me on some projects, and I have full intentions on keeping her involved (jointly with a transitional employee) until her possible last day.
This is the "business" side - as I said, I have no idea about legal/ regulatory issues specific to CH, so perhaps someone with better knowledge can chip in. Congratulations again, wonderful news!!!
You definitely can give notice before your maternity Leave. I did as i really respected everyone I worked with and they would have been in a terrible position if i had waited till during my maternity leave. By law you will still be paid your full maternity period.
My advice would be to not have any sort of conversation until you know that you are really sure that you are going to return back to the UK and also till you have had your baby.
You will not leave for maternity leave till August and although you like and respect your employers once you have spoken of your future plans your position might change. I have known it happen to people who have been upfront.
Sorry if I sound like an old cynic, but best of luck with the pregnancy
@BokerTov - thanks for all the kind wishes - we are very excited I was thinking something similar re: being up front with my direct boss (based in the US) and not making anything official with HR until it's necessary. My boss has actually left the firm twice already during his career so I think he'll understand
As smackerjack (thanks!) said...I'm wary of the legal side of it and the people who would deal with that are not people who I know - agreed that a large dollop of cynicism is definitely required in these situations.
Thank you all again for your advice - very helpful and appreciated
I'd say hand in your leave once your maternity leave ends. It's not like you are working for a 5 man firm who can't cope with maternity leave.
I was in the opposite situation when my assistant unexpected went onto maternity leave: you assume that the person is not coming back and hire a 'temp' who is nonetheless also a suitable replacement. In your case they could get a temporary secondment from the UK.
HR also told me that any resignations during maternity leave were also invalid. Having said that, HR were wrong about pretty much everything, so I would be surprised if they were right on something relatively obscure.
All in all, I think a "don't ask, don't tell" is the best policy. The truth is, that nobody knows until the time comes as circumstances could change (spouse could lose their job, etc.) during the intervening time.
One question though: have you thought that your employer will want to define your comming back and to what percentage before your maternity leave? - This is a current practice here. Be prepared to be questioned about that.
I'd give notice of your plans as soon as you know you are not comming back: Your employer owes you not only full pay during your maternity-leave but also a certificate, that you want to be positive for a future career.
Congrats! Based on a leave date of August, my guess is you are still fairly early on in your pregnancy. I would not rush into any decisions right now regarding giving notice. You never know what will happen over the next several months. Hopefully all goes smoothly, but sometimes it doesn't and then what? Before people start groaning, please read on:
I am not trying to upset you or make you freak out. I only mention this because a former colleague's wife gave her notice and did not plan to return to work after having their second child...then at about 5 months she lost the baby but she'd already given notice on her job. So then she was without a job AND without a baby and it was a horrible, horrible time. I would not wish that on anyone.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to be upfront with your colleagues and boss. I just think you may want to wait a bit before saying anything. Whether you make your intentions known now or a few months down the road will not dramatically impact your employer. Wishing you the best!
3wishes - no worries re groans I really appreciate all the input and this is a really good and valid point. This is actually something I'd thought about (probably a permanent worry for many pregnant people anyway!) and was thinking that it's kinda time for a change anyway (is being on EF at 10.40 at sign of complacency?!).
Phil - I will have you know that I am 100% irreplaceable and pretty much hold the whole place together However, in the event that they do start looking for someone new the whole process seems to take forever here (getting approval to hire someone, getting the advert out etc etc etc).
FMX - actually the reason that I came on here to ask about it is because HR are asking for me to return my maternity contract (which currently stands at 80% returning January 2014) before Easter and I wasn't sure whether to carry on as if I were accepting or to let them know now.
Anyway...I think that my plan will be to let my immediate boss know that the possibility is there and will wait until later on to inform the official powers-that-be!
As others have said, things can change. I would maybe tell the immediate boss that you are not sure what exatly you will do - it's after all quite normal to change your previous plans once the baby actually arrives. Wouldn't tell them that you're definitely not returning though.
I will try my best to explain my situation. Here are a few facts:
- baby is due first week of July
- I have a 2 month notice period
- my company pays a full 4 months of maternity leave
So my question is the following:
Let's say that baby arrives on July 7th. My company would pay maternity leave until November 7th. I need to resign a full 2 months prior to that. So if I resign during the month of September, the 2 month notice will be October and November, which means that I would have to physically work from Nov. 7th until the end of the month (which I do not want to have to do). If I resign during the month of August, the 2 month notice will be September and October, so will I be losing out on pay from November 1st to 7th?
Hopefully, one of you has been in the situation and can better help me figure out when to hand in my resignation...
It's normal for notice to be given for the whole month.
I think in this case you probably get to keep all your paid maternity leave (which is 14 weeks, possibly not 16)... and you agree to simply end the contract. I highly doubt it comes down to arguing over a few days - most employers would be quite happy that it ends mutually without drama.
At the end of the day, one weeks' pay vs. being forced back to work to 'work out' your notice period... I know what I would choose...
Taking maternity leave with no intention of returning is something employers really like! They enjoy holding your job open for your return, often paying a temporary employee to cover while you are away. By not returning they have to incur this cost as well as then beginning the recruitment process for your replacement. Finally when they have a permanent replacement they really enjoy not having your experience as part of the handover.
And people wonder why companies in Switzerland discriminate against women.
It is generally wrong to comment on situations without knowing facts and individuals' situations. I will accept it as your way of venting and not even try to prove you wrong as it is not in my best interest. Please, do keep in mind that everyone's situation is specific and should not be judged. Additionally, your post does not contribute to the thread!
On another note, women in most developed countries are discriminated against in the workplace, paid less, and not given equal career opportunities. This is something we all have to deal with and accept in we chose to have a career. Are we really given the choice? This is a topic for a different thread but in any functioning company, no one should be irreplaceable and the day the company needs to fire you, they will not be the ones feeling bad for you.
LauraG - Ask your HR department what the situation is if you choose not to return to work. No one can give you an accurate answer because every company is different.
Some companies do pay in excess of the legal minimum, so 4 full months maternity pay is not uncommon, but some also allows for the situation that some women will wish to end their employment following the birth of the child. In that case they may draw up an agreement to terminate the employment by mutual consent at the end of the leave period.
I'm not an expert in the law here, so it's important you discuss all options with your employer, understand any potential implications on maternity pay, and get everything in writing.
By the way, I think (again, only from my reading of the literature not from any legal expertise) that your maternity leave begins from the date that you choose to finish work. By law the earliest this can be is 2 weeks before the due date, and the latest is the day of the birth. (Your doctor may sign you off before 38wks but that extra period would be covered by sick leave not maternity leave.) So unless the baby is premature or you plan to stay in work until your baby shows up, you do have some control over when your 4 months commence. Why not start your 4 months leave on 1st July, just to make things simpler?
It is generally wrong to assume that a post is referring directly to yours when it doesn't include any quotation. Please, do keep in mind that although everyone's situation is specific and should not be judged, indicating on a public forum your attention to maximise your use of the system may show you in a less than flattering light. Additionally, the post raised a valid point!
On that note, women in most developed countries are discriminated against in the workplace, paid less, and not given equal career opportunities precisely because employers are well aware that women of a certain age represents a greater absence/non-productive cost than a similarly qualified man (partly due to the reason first cited). This is something we all have to deal with and accept when choosing and employee. This is a topic that sits naturally in this thread. In many functioning companies, no one should be irreplaceable and the day the company needs to fire you, they will ensure those individuals which are the only ones who know a distinct process in complete detail, adequately transfer this knowledge to their permanent replacement.
The minimum legal provision for maternity leave by law is 14 weeks commencing the day of the birth .
And here (from page 17 of the booklet) important information regarding employee termination of contract (emphasis mine):
..hence I would strongly advise against giving your notice before the birth as according to this you lose your entitlement to paid maternity leave! EDIT: see subsequent comments further down the thread.
Hope that helps to clarify the legal situation (at least according to the federal info available!)