Goodness. C permit or B and over 120k tax return is manditory AFAIK. Below 120K is optional and dependant on your circumstance as to whether or not it's worthwhile. You'll get generic tips or correct/incorrect opinion, but the only advise I'd follow would be from a tax consultant, if you really think it will make that much difference, as the tax breaks are the same.
Personally in the 6 years we have been here I have yet to see concrete proof of a C permit holder being factually treated better or receiving more favourable term on car leases than a B permit holder..... I think that should be treated like no peeing stand up after 22;00... urban myth .
My wife went from B to C, I'm still on a B, we have foreign income and property, have always had the tax return requirement (foreign stuff aside) are EU, and all I can say is that had we both still been on B's our tax rebate would be in the bank and spent, not sitting in the coffers of the Steueramt for 2 years. So a C will defo' having you filling in a tax form if you're not already, get you a green wallet rather than grey, and thats about it other than that... get thee to a treuhand or a tax specialist sir, and get a detailed analysis for tax purpose for your personal situation as to which would be better for you, then apply for that.
I agree. I still have a B permit but OH has a C and I can't see any difference at all other than he gets to vote in the cantonal and communal elections.
The only difference will be in tax and that's only if you don't have to make a declaration anyway and we all know that everybody on here earns at least 120 000chf so that's a moot point anyway.
Yes I just added the bit about tax declaration.
A C permit forces you to do the tax returns whereas a B permit holder below 'EF the poverty line' doesn't have to (and can't in so e places). That's the only instance where the permit will make a difference.
As for the last bit according to Wolli the German speakers will take over the whole country eventually since they are in the majority so I doubt there's be anything we French speakers could to to change that.
Dear all, I hope this is helpful. I can share recent experiences from friends regarding the 2 questions above:
A British citizen, she was always in full employment living and working in BS, received her C permit by post automatically in October 2016.
A British citizen living and working in BS, he had been unemployed just for 2 months when his B permit was due to expire in May 2016. His B permit was not automatically converted into a C one but instead he received another B permit valid for 5 years.
An Italian citizen, also in BS, he was not unemployed when his B permit was due for renewal in October 2016 but he had been unemployed for 10 months until September. His B permit was not automatically converted to a C but instead he received a renewal application form for a B permit by post in Aug or Sept (while still unemployed, before starting a new job) he returned the form explaining that he did not want another B but a C and sent his new employment contract showing clearly that he was starting a new job in Sept (before original B permit expiry). Nevertheless, he was told that the decision would remain on hold until he provided a confirmation letter from the company that his probation period was over. Only after this he received a C permit starting from the day after the original B expiry date.
None of the 2 people above who got C permits had to do police checks, credit checks, appointments, etc.
Even in the same Canton things seem to be on a case by case basis, depending on the specific situation of the person or perhaps on who's examining the case. If clear/specif/fixed rules are in place to cover all possible scenarios or most of them it's a mistery. It would be great to hear from a civil servant on this. Maybe there are only guidelines but not clear-cut rules. Perhaps this allows for some discretion and increases flexibility and adaptability of the Swiss admin system compared to other countries, I don't know, but it clearly creates confusion, worries and anxiety among the resident foreigners.
The three cases you mentioned are in line with the FMOP and it worth point out that same outcome would have happened in any EU sate as well. Where is your confusion?
Hi Jim2007, Thanks for your contribution although I am not sure if by FMOP you mean free movement of persons. Perhaps I did not express myself correctly as English is not my mother tongue. What I meant to say is that there seem to be some confusion among the resident foreigners on the topic "C permit automatic" for EU persons which seems to be automatic only in certain situations. I cannot answer on their confusion (if there's in fact any at all). It appears to me that many resident foreigners have no clarity on when the C permit is granted automatically after 5 years for EU persons and when it is not automatic. It would perhaps be good if you can share the exact rules, if you know them or have a link, or perhaps explain the rationale on the three cases I mentioned?
Again, it’s up to the cantons as each has it’s own rules. In Zurich for example you must also have a certain proficiency in German before a C permit is granted, although your Italian friend is exempt from this requirement due to the agreement Switzerland has with Italy - and of course Italian being a Swiss language. But your first British citizen wouldn’t get a C permit automatically in Zurich unless she also speaks and writes German to specified levels. Canton Zug is the same.
Also the Swiss government are planning to change the requirements for all permits anyway in the future to encourage more integration.
Thank you. Not that I care much but the third case of the Italian bloke puzzles me a bit: unemployed for less than 11 months, clearly in full employment at the moment of his B permit expiry regardless of his length of service in that job. It seems somehow unfair, although wise, delaying the decision to deliver his C permit, considering he was living here continuously for 5 years, in employment and exempt of language requirements for being Italian. It seems a bit arbitrary to me so I can see why some foreigners might be confused.
Surely the authorities were legally allowed to "delay" their decision or they would not have done it. However, I can see how this prerogative of delaying their decision could be used inappropriately. It would be interesting to know for how long can they "delay" their decision.
In my view they should have sent him his C permit straight away after he proved that at the time of the B permit expiry he was gainfully employed, regardless of his length of service or type or work. They should have been legally obliged to issue him a C permit at the end of his B instead of keeping him hanging until the end of his probation, obviously that is not the case.
I can see their point. If he hadn’t kept the job after the 3 month period then he would probably have been given a B permit again so they were quite right to wait and see if the position was going to be permanent or not. On the other hand if he was right at the end of his unemployment entitlement (not the case, but speaking hypothetically) and the job hadn’t lasted then he wouldn’t have gotten a new permit at all most likely.
You have to remember the Swiss voted to curb immigration from the EU which is sort of coming vaguely into force next February and also are looking at making the requirements to get and keep your permit more stringent. So the cantons are looking more on an individual case by case basis rather than just issuing without any checks.
I personally don't see much Advantage to a C - some have noted social and politcal benefit, I guess for those interested but as a taxpayer - i did like the Quellensteurer but OK no big deal.
For me, i don't get the sense there is any form of permanance at all with a C-Permit in the context that even if you hold a C-Permit and find yourself a the 5 year renewal Point in the Absence of a Job with tapping into the AHV/RAV welfare System for a sufficient time (what ever time that is) they can still reject you. As i understand it, the sense of "permanant resident" does not come until after 15 years Holding a C-Permit, that is 3 renewals of such where basically you're "in" iirrespective of Job Status.
So am i mistaken to believe the C-Permit is not really a permanant resident as say compared to the US where you may Need to nearly beg to get rid it. (called a Green Card in the US).
Yes, C permit like citizenship is difficult to get on a permanent basis and will likely become more difficult to get and keep in the future with requirements for more integration or you either lose it or get demoted back to a B. From the proposals being made even after 15 years it won’t be permanent unless the Swiss think you’re integrated enough.
I had to bring a "Betreibungsauskunft" (no "poursuite" ?), statement from my employer that I was still in a job and a statement that I never received any social help (Kt Zurich). Language certificate depends on your nationality.
Whether B or C, you need to go in and renew your permit, which means supplying the same documents/information as you did when you applied for your original permit (work contract, etc), plus proof you have not financial judgments against you, basic local language level, didn't get social welfare ( not to be confused with unemployment insurance), etc.
If you search through the forum, there are numerous threads that list out the various documents and where to get them.
Thanks. I was under the impression from another thread (2015) that I should expect a letter in the post during February, then I just go and drop my permit and they supply me a C within a couple of weeks. That was specific to Neuchatel.
I guess I'll try my luck and if I receive nothing by mid-Feb I'll go to the controle des habitants.
You’ll get a renewal letter in the post a couple of weeks (3-4 weeks or so) before your B expires. Fill it in, sign it and send it back.
You will receive your new C permit a week or so later. There are no requests for debt register extracts and stuff like that in Neuchâtel.
You may be asked for a language certificate under the new law but it only came into force on a January 1st this year and the cantons have some time in which to implement this. We renewed our C permits in NE this month and they weren’t required.
I suspect that depends on your Commune/Gemeinde/Commune. My own experience is that that if your paperwork is nominally in order, it's more a formality than anything else. Of course it helps to be a 'gute Ausländer' too, which appears to be defined as EEA, English speaking, Caucasian, 'good' Christians 8211; the more of those boxes you tick, the better your experience, I suspect.
I can't remember ever getting a reminder, but this was a good few years ago. Also, I would not rely upon clockwork-like Swiss efficiency and being sent one - after five years, you may have realized that this is not always the case here.
We were quite prepared to have to go and get ourselves a language passport if necessary but the next available date for the fide certificate tests was the end of February and the new permits arrived before then.
At the Brexit roadshow event in Bern they said that the cantons had until 2020 to fully implement the new language requirements so it8217;s highly likely that Enozhee won8217;t need to provide anything. The language certificate has not been a requirement for changing from B to C for EU citizens in Neuchâtel up to now.