Why are the exams at ETH so difficult ? It seems that the Swiss and German students pass them with ease but most people I know from overseas have had an awful time doing well on them, myself included.
I started the masters program (Mechanical Engineering) at ETH in 2007 after working in the US for three years, before which I got my undergrad degree at Cornell University. I got into MIT's graduate program, but turned them down for a unique opportunity to study at one of Europe's finest universities.
Maybe I'm getting dumber over the years (but I'm still only 26, c'mon!), but in my opinion the exams at ETH are very, very difficult. There are two types: written and oral. I've taken about four written exams, and they are far too long and rarely are similar to the homework assignments. At best, I've had time to attempt 75% of the questions. One exam I only had time to attempt 50% of the questions. For this reason I have either failed or just barely passed all written exams I've taken. Oral exams I've fared slightly better. However I never do better than average -- it is extremely difficult to focus when two Professors are staring you down less than a meter from your face. To make it even more aggrevating, I've studied way harder than I ever had at Cornell. It seems even if I prepare completely, I still manage only to get at best an average grade in the course.
Also, what is the idea behind your entire course grade coming from a solitary exam?
ETH is a great school, certainly I've learned a ton. However never before have I experienced something where you put in all your effort, and you even feel like you've mastered it, and you still are slapped with a failing grade?
Well fortunately even given all the troubles, I'm now only need 2 more credits to get my degree, and then I will go directly back to industry without ever looking back at academia. I will miss Switzerland however
I came from polish university where I thought - the level is so high.
But everything has changed when I went to Technical University of Lausanne... Although - I was very satisfied of the quality of courses etc..etc... my nightmare started during exams session.... and even I did my best - my notes was not high... There were 2 situations that got on my nerves the most:
1) Although I asked the Proffesor to have questions in English (as in some specific questions I could be lost even if my French is not bad) - I got French version with best wishes of Good Luck in written exam.
2) Oral Exam. I can manage questions in French, also it is OK when the comitee is speaking French to me .... but when stressed - I forget this d*** language so I switch into English automatically. And this was the reason I almost failed...
So far, the exams I've seen here make me shudder - all open book, long times to do short questions and there are many, many questions to choose from. The professors here were horrified that we don't have open book exams back in Blighty. Mind you, it might well be different between Chemistry and Engineering, but sounds like you had a rough time of it. Don't worry - you only have to do it once and then you've got the letters after your name. You'll also only use them twice - once when applying for jobs and the other when writing letters of complaint...
I haven't studied here but I heard that the standards at ETH are very high. Many colleagues at work have to graft till late at night and sometimes hear them take a day or two off from work in order to prepare for their exams. Myself I completed MSc/PhD in electrical engineering but not successively. I have had it after 5 years of my master and wanted to get some industrial experience. Afterwards when I caught a second wind only and then I came round to my doctorate. I can understand your frustration and would try to get it all out of the way first and then take holidays before starting actual job. Good luck with your remaining exams!
I also had a bit of a shock when I studied in Europe (coming from a North American system). I had the exact same experience as you: the exams were so completely and totally different from the coursework I half-wondered if I'd been given the wrong exam. I'd spent months mastering the small points of the subjects I was studying, then I was whalloped with exams that were TOTALLY different from any assignment or midterm exam I'd taken, and had absurd questions such as "use the material we covered in week two of the course to explain the meaning of life in a ten-page essay". (Or something similar to that. My memory is a bit scant on the details, but I'm pretty sure the meaning of life was in there somewhere.) I knew every equation and theorem and fact we'd learned, but the whole 'extrapolate to the bigger picture during the exam' concept threw me for a loop.
My only advice to you is that if you have more exams, use past experience to help prepare for future ones, and try to think a bit more in the abstract. I know it's very hard to anticipate what abstract questions you might be asked, but at least preparing 'hypothetical' abstract questions for yourself and trying to come up with answers is good practice. And it never hurts to approach the prof before the exam just to clarify what type of knowledge they expect you to have.
I feel your pain... I could go off on a three page rant about the screw up system here with regards to the pathetic attempts to align with the EU integrate the bologna system (bollocks system if you ask me, but noone is so...) and the adverse affects it is having on exams, structure and organisation of the courses offered. (Uni is doing more of a cock up than the ETH or so I've heard).
Frankly, the chances that you didn't pass your exam have little to do with how good you were and more with how good everyone else was...
Take a deep breath, and go over the exam. I know that at Uni you can get your exam back and if you disagree with the grading you can put your case forward. I would however suggest trying to get hold of it so you can see where you went wrong.
Exams to me are a poor measure of your knowledge and ability and tend to be far more a measure of your ability to quote facts verbatum ideally so the person marking it doesn't have to think.
From the bottom of my heart, I wish you more success at your next round of exams...
My impression of electrical engineering at the ETH was that they torture you for the first year to test your stamina, and if you survive that they torture you a bit less for the second year just to see if you really still mean it. From the third year onwards it's just fun and party and myself and all my friends were getting good grades for not our best efforts. We saw it as a kind of reward for the suffering we put up with in the first two years.
(Securing flame-proof helmet): Are you sure it's just not too hard for you? Respectfully - ie I'm not mocking here - could it not be that it really is a higher level than you were expecting?
I have not studied at the ETH (elsewhere ) but have heard the drive necessary to keep up is high. Could it be you're just feeling the burn now? It's an elite Uni; an elite employer would also make you sweat for the first few years, even after completing a tough academic path.
I'm asking as I'm interested in the human angle of this issue
I studied EE at the Warsaw University of Technology, where there was an entry exam in math and physics as the ratio of pursuers to vacancies was ca 2.5. About 1.5 more students than planned were admitted. The first two years of studies required immense commitment with rigid and tough areas like calculus, numerical methods and etc. It truncated the group to the required number of students during the first two years. Only at the end of the third year as we were about to choose our specialized departments, the tough subjects and level of difficulty decreased. The last two years when I was writing up were more relaxed and only then one could look for a part time job. Interestingly, when I exchanged impressions with colleagues from same faculties across EU, they would share similar sentiments.
My wife did her PhD in the states, and her post-doc here in a private company. One thing I'll note being an outside observer of her in this whole process. It's not just ETH, every serious university, there is a significant difference between undergraduate and graduate work. It's part of the process. I know a few people that flunked out of her PhD program because they couldn't pass the qualifiers, even though they were excellent students in undergrad. It's what it is. In part there may be some cultural things that make it a level more difficult for you, but alot of it is the change from being an undergrad to a grad student. Even though you're only getting a masters, you're still doing alot of the same courses the PhD students are doing, at least that's how it was in the states for her, and i believe that's how it works here too.
It's tough, my wife had many moments, though they mostly came in the experiments after passing her qual exams. I believe recalling that in her group, only about 60% passed the quals first try, she was one, but I know a few colleagues that didn't, though eventually they went on to get the doctorates.
Grind through it, it will all be over, then you need not look back :-)
Changing educational systems is extremely complicated and is an extra effort that you will have to assume. Once you will get the hang of it, your exams will go much smother and you will be doing much better. It takes a while before you adapt and start to do a better preparation to your exams. Also, when you are doing advanced studies you are expected to start integrating knowledge and apply it to new situations, and develop critical and independent thought.
I have experienced exactly the same difficulties every time i have changed cycles and/or universities and/or country. It hurts now, but you will get over it and i am sure it will eventually pay up for the effort.
@Dougal--> PhDs are a labour of love. I still haven't find any interest in mine....
...just to mention in passing to the above post. As humanities were not my major subject of preferences, as anyone else doing their PhD in Electrical Engineering, I had to take subject "Philosophy" oral and written, along another subject "Foreign Language" and "Technical Subject" as the third exam. Now it makes sense why they call it "Philosophy Doctor". These subjects were mandatory just before I publicly defended my disertation.
That's why some call it "piled higher and deeper" and I agree that grad and postgrad studies reach "another level" of getting involved in mystery of science.
You raise a question that I've been forced to grapple with on several occasions. At first I think I was definitely underprepared, but after several semesters here I feel I'm more or less on par with the other students.
When I first failed an exam I was furious afterwards, and was certain the professor was being unfair and I was eager to challenge the grade. After a few days I calmed down and decided just to retake the course a year later. Now, I realize the standards here are different and admit I had deserved to fail that first time. I retook the exam, and actually got my ETH record high score. But in another case, I similarly re-took the course and learned the material to a level I thought for sure was at least satisfactory. Actually I thought I did better on the assignments as well as the exam, but somehow ended up with a worse grade. In this case I'm pretty sure the system is at least partially to blame. I could probably write a whole thesis on how well exams represent a students understanding.
Is it not an idea to get hold of past exam papers and work through the questions on those? Then at least you get used to the style of the exams and can fine tune your exam technique and have an idea of how to tackle different types of questions. Estimate how long you need to allow to answer a particular question, then set a stopwatch and work through it - then you can see where you need to improve.
That's what I did for O, A and degree level. You still have to know the material but at least you don't get a surprise on the day. The other thing I did at A-level was get hold of the examiner's report from the previous years which states what they were looking for in the case of the longer essay-type questions.
At Uni, a course-mate and I swotted together and worked through all the available past papers from the university library which certainly paid off. If you are not used to the system here, maybe it is worth taking advice from Swiss course-mates who know the system and can give you tips.
When I did my MSc in geophysics in the UK, the exams were real ball-breakers, but as the OP notes, at least they reflected the course material. I have had a few Swiss mates ask me to help them study for their English exams at various levels, and have been amazed at the number of questions that are phrased in a terribly vague way and apparently designed to entrap. (And yes I have studied English grammar.) There also seemed to be required (rote) answers to certain questions, and the phrasing of the question was the clue that answer number # was required. The Swiss seemed to know this somehow, I could never work out the secret code they were using.
Keep plugging away, the qualification certificates would not be worth anything if they just gave them away...
I had the same. However this wasn't a university thing as I had already got thoroughly used to that at school (in the UK) and by the time I reached university I was fully aware of the traps.
Maybe it's a question of some schoolteachers not preparing their pupils for that adequately.
We used to amke jokes about one half of the points being awarded for just reading the question, but later I saw that this wasn't a joke. I was later involved in the setting and marking of exam papers myself (at the ETH) and I was always amazed and stunned how difficult it was to outsmart the students.
I did my Master thesis here, thus, besides the oral defence, I have not had the 'honour' of actually taking an exam here. However, as I compared my experiences with my colleagues from the ETH, I have to say the Ecole Normale Superieure of France (where I did part of my Master) have a much crazier system.
I was educated in a British- based system so it was a total shock to my system. At the ENS, there are no study leave for students to prepare for the exams. We had our last lecture on say, Friday and the exam would be the coming Monday or Tuesday. There were times when we had 3 major papers on the same day. For students sitting for the 'aggregation', I was told that some exams take up to 8 hours (students were allowed to eat in the exam hall). In a week, we would have sat for 7, 8 or more papers. The whole thing really wears a student down. The lectures were very tough as well. There were days where we had lectures from 8:30 - 20:30, with probably just 1 hour for lunch and 10 mins for the change of lectures. Lectures can take up to 4 hours per subject, sometimes with no breaks.
Thus, I really salute the French students who goes through this year after year.
patrickrd, sorry if I digressed. Just so you know that there are worse condition elsewhere. ;-)
But out there, in the real world, the bigger picture is what it is all about. Personally I much rather prefer the type of exams they seem to have at ETH than the multiple choice type of exams that are so common in the Anglo-Saxon countries. I prefer to focus on actually understanding what I am reading rather than learning details by heart.