Hello! I'm currently learning French. I'm planning on moving to Switzerland once I'm fluent, may take a while. But I was wondering, what are the pros and cons to learning French over German? I understand that German is the predominantly spoken language in Switzerland. So I would consider that a con. What are some others? Also, if I do end up just learning one of the two, French or German, would I still be able to communicate with non French speaking people through English?
Also, one of the reasons why I've made up my mind to move to Switzerland is for the nature. Of all the cantons, which have the most plains, grasslands, hills, lakes, and rivers? Are any of the French speaking cantons (including bilingual ones) in that type of environment? If not... I may consider learning Swiss German as well as French, or I may just drop French altogether. Because, shallow as it may seem, I would like to be surrounded by what I consider the most beautiful surroundings.
Also, one more question. Which canton is more foreigner friendly with regards to distributing work permits? Hopefully there are some French speaking cantons that are helpful towards people wishing to relocate to Switzerland. If not... I will have to seriously reconsider which language to learn.
Hello, well yes, Switzerland is a country with lots of faces. I live in Switzerland. It depens where you want to stay. If you prefer the Westpart of Switzerland (french) then of course you should learn french. Switzerland has 4 languages (Swiss, French, Italien, Romantsch) and yes most ppl close to cities speak english, so that would not be a problem. The Westpart is more legère and it has mountains like Kanton Fribourg or Neuchâtel or Jura what speak french. Have you been in Switzerland before? Go have a look at myswitzerland.ch If you learn Swiss-German as well then your door is open ;-)
Have a good day! Greets from Kanton Luzern (swiss-german-speaking)
Congratulations on your decision and you really seem to be taking a very thorough approach to your move.
To start with, you must realize that Switzerland is a tiny country by Canadian standards. So, if you ask where " most plains, grasslands etc." are, you might be in for a disappointment. Switzerland doesn't have any plains - it's just too small. Hills, well mountains actually, we've got plenty of those and they run through the middle of the country from west to east (depending on where you start). So the Cantons of Bern, Grisons (both German-speaking), Valais (French) and Ticino (Italian) are all touched by the alps.
Lakes: there's a big one in the French part (Lac Leman), another big one just by Zurich (Lake Zurich), parts of northern Switzerland border on Lake Constanz, in Canton Bern there are a couple with the town of Interlaken (literally: between the lakes) situated, errrr, between 2 lakes.
Rivers: we've got the Rhine running through the eastern (German-speaking) part of the country (it starts in Switzerland actually), the Rhône (down in the French-speaking part), the Ticino, which gave that Canton its name.... Take your pick!
Your best bet would probably be to come over and spend 2 - 3 weeks travelling around the country. Each region has its own beauty, it all depends on where you feel you'd like to settle.
Spend some vacation time here first and think about how you are going to support yourself. If you're not rolling in it you're gunna need to earn. If you can't speak either French or German well then you're options may be limited to working in the bigger cities like Zurich, Geneva and Basel for one of the larger corporations. I live in Zurich. French is relatively non existent here. English is normally preferred by young people. I'd think about language after I have found a job. You may find that work in the French speaking part is not in your field of expertise.
Visas also come into it. If you're an EU citizen (or able to get an EU passport through ancestry, then get it now). Otherwise you could find getting a visa is an additional hurdle. Wherever you live, the country is small and whatever nature you're interested in, you'll find it a relatively short journey by train. Good luck.
Wow thank you for such a swift reply! It's greatly appreciated. I'm relieved to hear you say that many people near cities can speak English. I have not been to Switzerland, I would really love to go soon though! Thanks, you have a good day as well! I will check that website now
WOW! Thank you for such a comprehensive description of what many of the cantons are like with regard to the environment. That's great to hear about the lake in Lac Leman. I will take your advice and book a flight for a visit before making a definite decision. But based on the information you've given me, it seems like I should learn both languages as each French and German speaking canton have some great areas. I have one inquiry, is Swiss German very different from another dialect of German, say... High German? Because I'm wondering if there is a "standard" German that would be intelligible in Switzerland and outside of it.
Thanks for the reply!
Yes I most definitely will. And also, a job will be another hurdle, like you mentioned. I will take your advice and research what employers generally look for regarding languages.
Hmm, I'm not quite sure if I would be able to get a visa through ancestry. Only my dad is European (by blood), my mother is not. And my dad was born in Canada, as was I. So that would mean I would not be able to get a EU visa through ancestry right? Thank you very much for the reply!
It is very different, but if you speak "standard" German like the people from the big country to the north you won't have any issues (maybe some Germans would disagree... joking). It may be a bit like a French man going to Quebec, except the difference between Swiss & standard German is greater.
Hmmm.. to be honest, if marriage isn't an option (joke!) then you need to be skilled in some way for one of the big corporations to sponsor a visa for you. You could look at graduate programs offered by some of the bigger corporations or simply if there are visas for casual/temp work available from the Swiss Government (check out the Swiss Embassy website in Canada)--there could be some bilateral agreements as Swiss can go to Canada on a temporary work permit for a year. Regarding your dad. You need to check what country he has ancestry to and then contact that country's embassy for details--it would help if your dad has/had European citizenship through his parents.
Oops, my mistake. I meant EU passport. I would not be able to get a EU passport through ancestry, correct?
Ahh I see. Well if I do choose to learn German it will be a more standardized dialect, I've been told German is one of the hardest languages to learn though... Is that true? Is German one of your native languages?
Ahh I see, that makes sense. I will check the Swiss Embassy website in Canada right now, thanks! Well my dad has a Portuguese mother and British father, but he never did become an official EU citizen nor does he have an EU passport. This would sever any ability for me to gain an EU passport through ancestry right? If not... That's awesome. But I won't get my hopes up.
I think the Slavic languages or perhaps Chinese languages are harder. Within the west European set though (English, Spanish, Portuguese, French and Italian) it is probably the harder one... or so they say. I am not a native. Born and raised in the UK. I have been here 7 years. I am now able to get around normally and have a conversations... but by any means not to a level like English.
Check with both the Portuguese and British embassies. An EU citizen is simply anyone being a citizen of an EU country. Switzerland has bi-lateral agreements with the EU that allow EU citizens to work here without visas (in the regular sense).
It depends on the EU country your Dad's ancestry stems from. In some of them, you could still get a passport and some not. It depends on the laws of the specific country. Which country is it?
I usually recommend just learning whichever language most interests you, so that sounds like French for you right now. And it would help you live in Switzerland for sure. German is a bit harder to learn than French, but I've certainly come across plenty of more complex languages than German.
Even if the country is multi-lingual it doesn't mean everyone knows or uses the languages on a daily basis.
Where you plan on going determines which language you will learn simple as that.
There isn't a lot of language mixing in the country but at the same time it's not uncommon to be in German speaking part and seeing a lot of french speakers and perhaps vice versa in the french speaking part.
Where the real issue comes in regarding german is learning high german or swiss german. German seen as a professional language while swiss german is more of a social integration language which doesn't mean it isn't used on the job either far from it.
If you want to learn French stick to it.
Don't add any type of german at least not at this time .... as a matter of fact I'm wondering how many people here who were non native speakers of either of the languages mentioned have gone as far as to learn both if not the three of them
One last thing about the size of the country. Just because it's small doesn't mean it's the same everywhere quite the opposite.
You could easily go to another city 30-45 minutes away and feel like you are in a completely different world, especially with things like culture, mentality, openness and language.
Before committing a large amount of time to learning your chosen language, please do a lot of research to make sure that if you are unable to get an eu passport, that you have skills that are rare here. There are plenty of posts on here from people who have been trying to get a job here for anything from six months upwards. Granted they tend not to have the necessary language skills, but they do have the right to work here due to being EU. It is getting harder for companies to sponsor you for a work permit, as the numbers have been decreased, so unless you have a relatively rare skill you going to struggle. Employers have to favour a Swiss or EU national over other candidates. Anecdotal evidence on here suggests that agencies won't even reply to your enquiries. A better route may be to get a job with a company in Canada with offices here and apply for an internal transfer.
Sorry to be so negative, but that is the reality, in the same way that Canada has strict immigration laws for us.
My advice is to stick with your French language studies.Remember 20% of Swiss people speak French as their mother tongue and it is spoken in the western third of Switzerland.You can go to Geneva,the Vaud canton that's the city the of Lausanne and the towns of Vevey and Montreux.
There is the canton of Neuchatel and the western half of the Valais canton,that's the lower Valais.So if you want to to continue with your French studies.Then go and live in the French-speaking part of Switzerland.In French that's La Suisse Romande.
Yes Chinese is so hard. I've been learning it for 12 years now... Terribly difficult. Alright, I'll do just that. And you started learning German right once you go to Switzerland? Thanks for the reply!
Would you recommend learning German after I become fluent (or at least proficient) in French? Yeah, I would think Britain not so much. Hopefully Portugal will allow me to though. Let's hope you're right! Thanks for the reply!
Thanks for the advice! I'll take that into consideration. Currently I'm leaning towards French because I already have a basic grasp of it. That's exciting to hear how diverse the nature is in Switzerland. I can't wait to see for myself! Thank you for the reply!
Thanks for the insight. And I agree, it's best to take into account all the possible negative scenarios so that they can be prepared for. I will take your advice and do a lot of research and see exactly what Swiss employers are looking for. Thank you for your reply!
Wow I had no idea there were that many French speaking cantons, that is a relief. Is Bern also a French speaking area? Thanks for the reply!
I would like to add to the discussion about German being difficult... that's just not true. I have been studying both French and German. I didn't start German until my French was further along, but it is not anymore difficult- just different. I think the German grammar takes more getting used to initially, but once you understand it it is much easier then French. Even as an advanced speaker of French I still struggle with grammar sometimes. The hardest part of German is pronunciation and gender of nouns (for me).
The other thing to be aware fo is that the German you will learn in Canada is not the local German spoken, It is the German of business, but not of everyday life... so be prepared!
That's a relief to hear. Do many people in Switzerland speak more than one official language? And I think if I were to learn German it would probably be while I'm already in Switzerland and can speak French fluently. Otherwise I'd be afraid of mixing up the languages. Thanks for the reply!
students go to school and learn mostly in german. Swiss german is a spoken language.
Everything official is in High german, newspapers magazines etc too. Local news and radio in Swiss.
It's safe to assume that most people who speak swiss german speak some if not more commonly extensive/fluent german. It's not uncommon to find good french speakers in this part of the country.
For the french speaking part they do learn some german in school but it's a real issue as they tend to not be as good as their northern counter parts learning the other language. This causes real problems for mobility in the country as the french speakers don't have that good of access to northern switzerland jobs because of linguistic issues.
Yes, most people in Switzerland speak more than one language. This is also taking into account italian and romansch speaking parts of the country.
Thanks for letting me know about that, I had no idea. And, why do you think it's harder for the native French speakers to pick up German? Is it because less courses are provided for learning German? Or is it just that German is difficult for them? Also, one thing concerns me, if I do pick up some High German before entering Switzerland, will it be intelligible to Swiss German speakers? And one more thing. Do the Swiss authorities grant permits and citizenship based on integration in the Swiss community? If so, would it be more likely to be accepted if I spoke German rather than French?
I'm really surprised that no-one in this thread has yet pointed out that there isn't really any one language called "Swiss German". There are literally dozens of Swiss German dialects spoken in Switzerland. Swiss German varies by canton and even within cantons. In Canton Bern, I am aware of at least four different dialects of Bernerdytsch, the local "Swiss German". Many people fluent in Baslerdytsch (spoken in Basel-Stadt) cannot understand Walliserdytsch (spoken in Wallis/Valais). It sounds extraordinary for such a small country, but there are so many different languages here!
I wouldn't even think about trying to learn "Swiss German" before you settle somewhere here. If you really want to commit to learning German, learn High German (Hochdeutsch). Every school in German-speaking Switzerland is required by law to teach in Hochdeutsch, so every Swiss German-speaker can communicate in High German.
As for French people finding German difficult, the same is true in reverse. I would say it's down to the natural, ancient, historical antipathy between the two countries and by extension the two linguistic areas of Switzerland. The grammar, syntax, even genders are quite different.
Permits: integration is not necessary (depends on the job). Citizenship: yes, absolutely, you must speak one of the national languages to ascend to the exalted status of Swissness.
Oh wow, so my best bet would be High German. Thanks for pointing that out to me! Are all the different dialects of Swiss German mutually intelligible? Is it easy for native speakers of German to pick up the different dialects of Swiss German? Thank you for the reply!