Future life in Switzerland

Visas, Permits, Passports and Naturalization
1
Hello there.

I'm really happy to find this English forum of Switzerland. It comes very handy for me. I'm remarking now - it's going to be a long thread. If you have the time and will to read it and help me, you're welcome and I'd be thankful.

My name is Ariel Weinberger, I am 18 years old. I currently live in Israel.

Ever since, our small family (mother, brother and grandpa) were visiting Switzerland at least once-twice per year (Zurich at all times). With over 15 visits to Switzerland, we really "got used" to life in there. My mother kinda fell in love with the country and after my last visit (a month ago) when I decided to see more nature and city life other than shopping and entertainment, I fell in love with it too.

I come from a country where people don't really do anything to affect bad situations (such as economy and infrastructure). The life over here is very expensive and I don't have the eagerness to succeed in here.

I'll be a bit straight now - my mother will wait for my enrollment to the Israel Defense Forces, and once I finish my military service she wants us to move to Switzerland (me, my mother and my little brother). I fully agree.

Until now I didn't know much about the Swiss protocols, processes and such for tourists, immigrants and newcomers. I basically want to know what are our chances to even be accepted into Switzerland, considering these facts: My grandfather (RIP) has put money over in a Swiss bank (I don't remember it's name exactly, but it's located in Zurich) right after the WWII. The money is stored there for decades. Our lastname is based off German, "Weinberger". Before moving to Switzerland, I will have 6 years of experience in the Israel Defense Forces as a Software Engineer, in the "Mamram" ( link 1 , wikipedia ).

Mamram is a very reputed project in the IDF, by the ICT Corps, consider the fact that the whole training and qualification is done by the ICT of the IDF, which is in terms of experience indisputable (How required are Sodfware Development Engineers in Switzerland?). We speak fluent English (totally fluent, not including by little brother of course). Our grandfamily went through the holocaust. Our travel record is full of visits in European countries only, including Germany, Netherlands and mainly Switzerland (I know this fact might not mean anything, but I'm just saying). We own few properties in Israel (three high end houses) and vehicles. We are fine economically (I'm saying that because I'm pretty sure the Swiss government does not want to accept immigrants who have economical issues as they might badly affect the Swiss economy). I finished high school with average results. After studying Electronics I have got a certificate for Electronic Systems (I don't plan to have my career in Electronics, but in the computers world. However, it's still a high school certificate and it might affect things behind the scenes). My family is eligible for a UN passport (Hungarian) due to my grandpa being born in there (back in 1912). However, we're not interested in an Hungarian citizenship.

I am really sorry for the length of this message.

Please forgive me if fool things were said here, I'm just trying to do my best for my future. Don't be too tough please.

What are our chances, as a family of three, to have the ability to live in Switzerland in the next years?

2
Most of the points you included will neither positively or negatively affect your chances of coming to Switzerland, apart from 7.... Money.

There are two main ways to get a residence permit here. 1, gain employment 2, have enough money to support yourself without employment. As non EU it can be difficult to gain employment in Switzerland.

Every person in the family would need enough money to support themselves, or the would need to be considered a dependant of a certain member of the family. Ie you Mother would have to be employed & earn enough to sponsor the rest of the family.

3
After she has talked to a lawyer, my mom is planning to have an independent business and she intents to hire Swiss workers to support the economy.

I plan to complete my SDE (Software Development Engineering) degree in Switzerland. When it comes to money we will be definitely fine.

Thanks for the fast response.

4

To take your points one by one:

  1. Makes no difference whatsoever that your grandfather had money here.
  2. Neither does having a German based name.
  3. Yes, software engineers are needed; hopefully it’ll be the same in a few years’ time.
  4. English is okay, but you really need to have a good command (written and oral) of at least one of Switzerland’s 4 languages, depending on where you eventually plan to settle. Western part of the country is French speaking, Eastern is German (Swiss-German to be exact with lots of different dialects, but High German is used too) or Italian down in the south.
  5. Not relevant
  6. You travel a lot, good for you, but not relevant
  7. You have to prove you can support yourselves when you arrive so being financially sound means you won’t be turned away at the border.
  8. Qualifications are of interest to employers, but it’ll be more on what you’ve accomplished since leaving school that will interest them most.
  9. Get interested in gaining Hungarian citizenship. As a member of the EU Hungarians are allowed to move here to seek work. As a non-EU you are not. You would have to have enough outstanding qualities for any potential employer to be able to say to the Swiss migration office that you are better than anyone else they can find who already lives and works here.

To maximise your chances, learn either French, German or preferably both, do whatever you can to make yourself more desirable in the marketplace and get Hungarian citizenship.

A couple of websites to look at for job prospects:

www.jobs.ch
www.jobup.ch

I know you don’t need them yet, but it’ll give you an idea of what’s available in your field of expertise.

For more info and to keep up with any changes in Switzerland’s immigration policy look here:

www.bfm.admin.ch

5
Awesome, thank you very much!

I'm actually studying German nowdays .

6

Great that’ll be really good for your CV when you come to start applying for jobs.

There’s also a book you might like to get hold of entitled “Living and Working in Switzerland” by David Hampshire. It’s full of useful info on the quirks and oddities of living here. It can be ordered via your local bookshop or from web-stores like Amazon.

Good luck and hope you make the move in a few years’ time.

7
Owning a business does not guarantee you a residence permit, you still have to go through the same process as everyone else, unless your company is able to take on several hundred people...

8
Also the rules to start a business can be daunting. The amount of capital you have to prove you have is often so high most people can't afford it. If you go with this option, make sure Mom is working with a Swiss lawyer that knows the rules intimately...not just a local Israeli with good intentions.

I second what Medea said about language skills and pursuing Hungarian citizenship.

Best of luck!

9
Of course, I never thought otherwise. Obviously the ability to have a stable business is not a shortcut.

Thanks, good luck indeed.

Actually her lawyer was residing in Israel and took care of Swiss cases until he himself moved to Switzerland. My Mom and him can still make contact.

10
As a Swiss lawyer myself, I beg to disagree.

It is definately not true that you'd have to hire several hundred people. In fact, hiring yourself and a very few others is perfectly fine and sufficient.

Furthermore it is very easy to start a business here, and the capital which actually needs to get paid in goes from 0.- to 100'000.- depending on which type of company you're interested in.

I do not practice in the field of immigration law, but could recommend an excellent lawyer if required (PM).

11
As someone who knows a person that started a company here, I would say it's a complex issue. The person I know is from the U.S. (therefore non-EU like the OP) and wanted to establish a company here. He could not just say he wanted to start a company and get himself set up. He had to have a Swiss resident partner, proof of 50,000 CHF cash, a business plan, and numerous other things. Having the business did not automatically entitle him to a residency permit. This was in Fribourg, maybe other cantons are different.

If it was super easy, every non-EU with a tiny bit of cash would be knocking at the door. That said, it's not impossible and if you know an excellent immigration lawyer I am sure the OP would appreciate the recommendation.

12
Let me clarify: I didn't mean to imply that owning a company automatically results in a residency permit.

In order to set up a company, one does not require a resident partner, but merely a representative with signing authority residing here, e.g. a lawyer.

This representative does not need to hold any shares/be involved in business operation.

Chances to receive a permit are good if one is able to convince the authorities that one is actually planning to start a serious and successful business. A business plan and some cash seem to be a good starting point for that, not just for legal reasons..

However, for immigration purposes starting a small firm is perfectly fine and the costs of incorporating a business are moderate.

13
Hello Boris! I have sent you a private message.

Thank you for putting your time into this topic.

Thank you all as well!

14
OK, let me ask you a very simple question then:

How many of your non-EU clients have set up a business employing say one or maybe two, hit minimum turn over levels to register for VAT, would failed to meet the standard criteria for obtaining a work permit under normal circumstances and was still granted a permit???

15
Dear Jim2007

Under Swiss law you are required to register for VAT if you reach an annual turnover exceeding 100,000.- CHF. Let's assume that you have only one employee whom you pay only 3,000.-/month. This results in "costs" of roughly 40'000.- (wage + social security contributions etc). For almost all types of business, you'll have substantial further expenses, for advertisement, rent etc.

As turnover and profit aren't the same, evidently under the premises you made, little to nothing would be left for the business owner. Running a business which does not provide a living for the owner is not what I consider a serious and successful business - and I am sure the authorities share this view.

That said, I don't do immigration law and therefore have no such clients.

Under normal circumstances, non-EU citizens need to (inter alia):

a) be highly qualified, i.e. master from a university as well as professional experience. Depending on the field also other people with special education/training/experience can get a permit.

b) make more than 100,000.-/year (the authorities are aware that in some fields like e.g. architecture wages are lower)

c) employers seeking to employ third country nationals have to prove that they have not been able to find a suitable employee from within Switzerland and the EU despite "intensive" search efforts.

Those are the 3 main requirements I can think of which are considerably less of an issue if one runs (or is planning to) one's own business - there are several reasons for this assessment, I won't go into the details now but am sure any colleague working in this specific field will be happy to explain them in detail. However, this those not mean that the remaining criteria are waived..

I believe it is safe to conclude that planning to run one's own business does make it easier to recieve a recidency and work permit - but only if said plan provides for a realistic chance that the business will provide for a decent living.

All I said in my initial post is that: a) a small company is sufficient and b) it is not that expensive to establish such a company. I did by no means intend to disagree with the part of your post which said " Owning a business does not guarantee you a residence permit".. (as already clarified in in my answer to 3Wishes replay)

16
Definitely go for Hungarian citizenship if possible, it will alleviate a lot of the hassles one must undergo as a non-EU national.

Also note however that immigration into Switzerland is now moving into a more restrictive mode and this will start to include immediate EU-15 neighbors (quota limits already put in place).

17
About the money in the swiss bank ,this is the guy you need [](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Edgar_M_Bronfman_1989.jpg) to talk to

18
Sadly it's not so simple... We don't seek for the Hungarian citizenship as we don't like (in fact, the opposite) the country at all.

Also, since I've already reached 18, both me and my mother will have to learn fluent Hungarian and pass a test. That would just be a waste of time.

19

Then do expect it to be harder to get in. As brusch says, there are already temporary restrictions on all EU nationals this year and these last until next June. Whether the Swiss will apply something similar in future depends on what happens with the stability of the EU as well as any measures brought before the Swiss people to vote on.

In many ways, it’s good that you’re planning ahead because it will give you time to investigate ways of making yourself more desirable in the jobs marketplace. But on the other hand, the continuing uncertainty over the EU and pressures of immigration on Switzerland could mean that the rules for non-EU’s get tightened up even more. I’m sure there’ll be plenty of threads here if anything major changes and you can also keep track of what’s going on via www.bfm.admin.ch .

20
So it is in Switzerland.. Its kinda kickass expensive..

Forget that money... It belongs to Swiss provided no nominee...

Completely irrelevant when it comes to immigration.. Sounds more like a Jewish name than German..

IT always have good oppurtunity here.. Thats the key.. But you need to have an employment contract first before even thinking of immigration and residence permit.

Fluency in German is VERY VERY much required for IT jobs along with English.. Finding only English speaking jobs in Swiss is like winning the Euro lotto except for some outsourced SW/ programming jobs.. Attend some lang courses man.. THIS IS NOT AN ENGLISH SPEAKING COUNTRY...

Very true...

Stilll better than some Non-EU passports.

Only facts.. facts based on reality..

Thats the most toughest query to answer.. Maybe 50/50, but its worth giving a try..

Best Wishes, Warlock