just had touched this topic with my wife about family and kids and giving birth.
I am British she is Swiss. She doesn't have a good opinion about the NHS and how the health system works in the UK. She thinks GP's in the UK are absolutely rubbish and useless and not dedicated but only after one thing: the money.
I agree but also disagree. With the NHS you find yourself on endless waiting lists and sometimes doctors aren't always that helpful.
She said she would never give birth in the UK as she is scared on how things get handled. Her friends in Switzerland go for several scans and get to see the doctor on a regular basis during the 9 months of pregnancy whether on the NHS you are entitled to two scans. If you wish to have more you will of course have to pay them separately. Plus she read and heard all sorts of terrible stories about maternity wards and midwives not doing their job properly.
What are your thoughts about this? Has anybody experienced giving birth in the UK and also Switzerland? what's your experience? and what advice can you give?
I would like her to understand that there is good and bad everywhere and every experience and each case different.
Well, your wife is incorrect about the NHS, certainly the "only after the money" mentality is far more prevalent among Swiss doctors who in fact are paid on an hourly basis/for a consultation.
However you're comparing apples and oranges - the Swiss system is private, the UK NHS is free at the point of entry. Try UK supplementary insurance like Bupa and come back to me.
agree with eco how can NHS doctors be after money? thats more likely to be in switzerland.
It's true re the scans, I had a scan every 2 weeks up to 12 weeks and every 4 weeks after over here, in the UK you do normally only get 2 scans (12 and 20 weeks) i think if you have issues then they'd do more but otherwise you pay.
Of course maternity wards will be bigger than the 3/4 person per room standard here - but I would never knock the actual service of the doctors/nurses/midwives. I think they are just as good as swiss ones it's just in Switzerland everything is packaged nicer in nicer hospitals, clinics smaller wards etc...
Another big difference is in UK your pregnancy is controlled by a midwife who visits your home for regular checks - over here you visit your Gyne for your regular checks, so you may only get 2 scans in the UK but you are regularly monitored by the midwives.
I think that a lot of people believe that because the hospitals/clinics look much nicer here, the food is (marginally better) and the consultations are generally longer = better medicine. In CH, there is good and bad as every where. Absolute horror stories have happened to friends and family here. However I have a Swiss friend who is a private midwife, and the service she described seemed top-notch, including after care. I am Swiss and had my children in the UK, and have nothing but praise for the NHS - but that is not to say there are no problems. I am Swiss but lived all my adult life in the UK - the question of having my children in CH instead of UK never even entered my head, I must say, It would have been so costly - are you still insured in Switzerland? I must say I totally disagree with your wife's comment about GPs in the UK. They are much better qualified than in CH, as they do have to follow 4 years specific training, unlike in CH. If she does not get on with your current GP, she should have sought another one and changed. A GP in CH might give you a 15/20 mins consultation, for which as Economisto says s/he will charge per minute -instead of the UK 5/10 mins (your GP is paid a fixed sum per year per patient- very different) - but that does NOT mean his medical skills/treatment is proportionally poorer.
Scans btw are not totally without danger, and should not be done too frequently. The 2 normally done in the UK, unless there are concerns and more are needed, seems to be the safest option. We did quite a bit of research about this when our daughter was pregnant with first child.
Thanks everyone for the comments. I expressed myself badly I guess.
What I meant "after the money" is whenever she needed a consultant for something a little more serious, because it took too much time to get it sorted via the NHS, she found they didn't take the time to explain her exactly what the problems were, instead, they just gave her a prescription as quick as possible. And that was with the private consultant (high fees).
She was quite ill for a while and the NHS was just a nightmare. They sent her back and forth so many times without being able to solve the problem.
At that point she went to see a private consultant.
She thinks the GP's in the UK don't sit down with the patients and go over the topic properly.
I agree with you in Switzerland things may look nicer but it doesn't mean that it always 100% perfect.
No she is not insured in Switzerland anymore although she has friends who are doctors and once a year she goes for a regular woman check up and pays cash.
She thinks that even when ringing up the local GP to make an appointment, it takes ages, and the staff is always rude. And also they do not follow up properly unless you ring them and keep asking.
I think it has a lot to do with what you are used to and how she grew up as a kid. From what I can see in the Swiss culture , they tend to go to their GP's quite often even if it's only flu.
I know a Swiss woman who lives in London. As I'm moving back to the UK I asked her: What do you like more or less in London. She said: she likes most of the NHS more as in Switzerland. She likes the health system anyway much better as in Switzerland.
I was born in the UK, I think I didn't suffer.
Seriously. I think it's not a big difference. I still have my relatives in Scotland. I visited my cousin in a Glasgow hospital and visited my other cousin's wife twice. It was very lovely.
I gave bith to my girl child here in Switzerland.
I don't see a big difference.
They both had a doctor in the delivery room, and my doc came after a nurse called him (at home). The baby was almost born!
I don't know about the food in British hospitals. The nurses were lovely in Glasgow and in Bern.
Of course it's different, but not better or worse. I wouln't care to get a baby in the UK!
I had 2 babies in the UK and both have managed to turn into healthy normal teenagers (if that is not an oxymoron).
Health care in the UK, both during and after the pregnancy, is given based on a needs basis. My first baby was premature and there were rafts of doctors/nurses on hand to treat her. And all treatment was totally free. However I saw no doctor other than my GP/midwife for both pregnancies and only midwives and health visitors after the pregnancies.
Now, however, the NHS has been 'leaned' by consultants (paid rather exorbitant rates) and a lot of the pre- and post-pregnancy workshops and baby clinics have been had funding terminated. In my opinion, this means that potentially harmful conditions, such as post-natal depression, are not picked up early enough.
So, the NHS comes up trumps if things are really bad and all care is free. However small problems can end up misdiagnosed or not diagnosed at all.
Our situation is as yours, I'm Brit, and she's Swiss. Our first daughter was born in London and our second, in Fribourg (CH).
Unfortunately, we're not comparing eggs with eggs.
When we were in London, she was working for a Swiss employer, and her (obligatory) Swiss health insurance, was always paid and covered all posts abroad. So we were lucky enough to go private (St. Mary's) so I can't comment on the NHS option.
However, having just asked her, she still says the 2nd pregnancy/birth in CH was a better experience, than the 1st in UK (although no problems or complaints with this).
Such sweeping statements. It's far too 'easy' to make overall judgements about one system/country, due to 1 or 2 unpleasant experiences, or indeed excellent ones.
It sounds to me that it would have been best for your wife to change GP and practice if she does not get on with GP or staff. However, it might not be the best time to do so if she is already pregnant. If she wants to have the baby in CH, she would need to have the full pregnancy followed up in CH surely. Would that be feasible? Certainly she would have to fly over a couple of times for check-ups, and then won't be able to fly after 34 weeks, so would have to come and stay with parents for the remainder time, + of course after giving birth for a while. If it is not, than the sooner she comes to terms with that, and tries to be more positive about it, the better. Longterm, living in the country where you don't trust the medical system is a bit of a time bomb, somehow. She can't come back to CH everytime she or the future child becomes ill, surely. So either she learns to trust the UK, or you may have to accept its off to CH for you.
Wish you the best of luck with everything. Out of interest, which part of the UK are you in?
agree on that. Not expecting yet. This was just a topic we were discussing.
She is with a new GP by the way.
I think she just had bad luck. And I feel sorry for her because like you , I don't believe it's all bad.
But for example we went to visit a friend in hospital who was very unwell, and she heard the nurses on the ward talking and one was saying to the other how she couldn't care less on that day as she just got her nails done, and was showing them to the other colleague...she couldn't believe her ears and thought that was not very professional...
Our first 2 were born in the UK and the third here.
I think that in the UK the standard may have alot to do with luck (i.e which hospital or area).
Whilst (being biased) at the time I thought the UK system was good, the 3rd birth here was considerably better (they even found a makeshift bed for me to lie on here during the night).
My better half says while advice isn't forced on you in the UK (i.e . breast-feeding pressure etc) and there is possibly more choice of type of birth, Switzerland wins hands down.
Arrgghhh PD - just don't know how to say this, but if she is really stressed about it all and not pregnant yet... wonder how she will feel when it does happen. If your OH does not feel happy and comfortable in the UK in general, and medically speaking in particular- then perhaps the realities will make little difference, somehow. Is she in UK because she loves the UK, or 'just' because she loves you? Wish you all the very best.
When I was in hospital in Basel, I was told by the Swiss nurses that the ones who wanted to make a real career out of nursing, would go to work in British hospitals for a while, because NHS trained nurses were in demand all over the world, because they gain far more experience on the job than nurses in other countries.
UK midwifery is also of an exceptionally high standard, especially for emergency situations. When we had private health insurance in the UK, we were told that they could only handle normal birth situations, and in an emergency, they'd take my wife to the nearest NHS hospital. On those grounds we went for NHS. We had three kids via the NHS, in three different hospitals, in three different parts of the UK, and the care was great.
However, your wife's fear is an irrational one, so no amount of facts or statistics are going to change that, so if she's happier giving birth here, and it's possible, then she should do so. Swiss hospitals are almost as good as UK ones for maternity care, so there isn't much risk.
OK, well, in general I and my family have always received much much better care here than in the UK. You don't wait, you get what you need, you see the right people quickly and if you need a treatment then you get it without waiting.
In the UK it seems to be pot luck. GPs don't really have time for you and you always have to wait - probably until you're better - before getting an appointment. Here you phone them and they see you the same day. If you need some test then the UK will send a sample to the lab and you wait for the result. Here a lot of tests are done in the doctors office. The doctors office here dispenses basic drugs too - so for example if you walk in with a UTI, the doctor will do the test, get the result and you walk out with a pack of antibiotics in your hand - in the UK you'd be in agony for a week before getting to that point.
I was so well looked after here when I had my babies - appointments every month, expert care, private ensuite room after birth, midwives and breastfeeding counsellors on tap. No need to wait to see anyone. Easy to get help. And I have the basic basic insurance. In the UK you'd never get a private room and you'd be sent home after 24 hours. Which may be fine for some, but certainly not all.
This year we've had a lot of health issues in our family - some minor, some major, and for all of them we've had fast and excellent service. Quick referrals and appointments. In the UK I think my husband would still be waiting for his operation - in fact he'd probably still be waiting for the blood test results. And my son too - he'd probably be on his 10th perforated eardrum by now and not have had his tonsils out. I know where I'd rather see the doctor.
I think the NHS is fine as long as you don't actually get sick.
In most places (well, the 3 maternity hospitals here in Basel anyway) you have the option to pay a couple of hundred francs to get a private room. For my first I didn't know that, but because the hospital was empty I didn't have to share. But even if I had had to share it was only a room for two anyway. Second time I paid the 200CHFs to guarantee a private room - because it's nice to not have to share a bathroom when you are bleeding like hell for example (sorry bit TMI there .)
Well I am British and my wife is Swiss. She worked in the NHS in Scotland for 9 years after qualifiying and working in Switzerland for six years.
She had both of our children in Scotland via the NHS, one of them having a water birth in a hospital with a community midwife. She has nothing but praise for the whole system - though as far as the maternity system experience that was 13 years ago.
She then worked in the N.Zealand health system before returning to work here.
She considers the UK NHS the best system she has yet seen or worked in where the patient has the most and best contro,l and options. Here in Switzerlamd the system is controlled by the Doctors and the Insurances and not necessarily in the patient's best interests.
Of course if it private rooms and consultants that are wanted then as previously said you have to compare like with like and look at the Uk private systems.