heavy metal chelation

Family, Education, Health and Pets
1
Ok, this is a REALLY long shot but I will ask anyway.

Does anyone here know of an English speaking heavy metal chelation expert here in Switzerland or in the surrounding countries? He needs to follow a protocol similar to Andy Cutler.

Also, anyone here know what I am talking about when I mention amalgam illness and Andy cutler?

Thanks

cheesenonion

2
Does anyone here have the details of a Dr Katarina Pasche-Vadnai? She has been highly recomended to me but the recomendee does not have her contact details and I have failed to find them as yet on a Google search

Thanks

cheesenonion

3
Could it be:

Dr Katalin Pasche médecin-dentiste Rue du Mont-Blanc 16, 1201 Genève Tel.: 022 731 14 24 Fax: 022 731 23 85

4
I like this long-shot thread. One from two ain't bad. Anyone seen a Charlaton tho'?

5
I have heard of both. Have you actually had mercury blood levels tested? Did you try any chelation yet and was it bearable and how did you compensate for the loss of useful metals like copper etc.?

Or are you about to start? I would be very interested in any experiences with chelation. Have you read his book and would you recommend it?

6
Hi Muze7, thanks for replying.

It's really good to know that someone out there at least knows what I am talking about! I am only in the process of looking for the Doctors so I haven't chelated yet. To answer your questions...

I am waiting on the results of a MELISA test, which tests for allergy to heavy metals. Blood levels from normal blood tests are not accurate as they will only show acute/recent poisoning. (I am referring to Mercury now as I don't know a lot about the other heavy metals). After that it finds a cosy spot to hide in the organs where it does it's long term damage and can't be detected via any normal tests.

Apparently certain hair analyses can be useful but may also show false negatives. Basically, you need someone to help you who is familiar with all the clinical signs and symptoms as well as various possible blood/urine derangements.

Andy Cutlers book is brilliant. He really knows his stuff. I just wish we could clone him and have a copy here in Switzerland! It seems that there are many practitioners practicing chelation dangerously. Oh and apparently it is a bit of a myth that chelation (when done properly) strips out the other useful metals to a greater degree.

I am really no expert - just learning as much as I possibly can. Would be happy to keep in touch in or outside of this group with anyone in a similar position.

cheesenonion

7
Thanks Lou, I have just found it myself - I thought she might have dropped the double barrelled bit!

cheesenonion

8
Ah, ok. It what my dentist said, but I know we are still in the middle of a paradigm shift where it comes to dental mercury, so I need to do my own research, obviously.

[HTML] That would be great, I have one more filling to be replaced, then I want to start to chelate too. So do you want to go to her for the removals? Or more than that? I am asking because there are dentists who advertise amalgam removal here in CH, at least, I assume that means they know the special protocol but maybe that is being optimistic...hmmm.

9
Please feel free to email me offline if you want to. I too would love to stay in touch with a fellow chelator!!! I don't speak German or French (although I am learning German slowly!!!) so the language has proved a bit of a difficult barrier both when researching and contacting specialists. I will be going to this Dentist to have the remainder of my fillings out - I am not sure yet if she prefers to do them one by one (I hope not!) or several at a time.

I really am no expert, only going by what I have read and learned so far.

I am told that she is probably THE only dentist who uses "safe" measures to remove amalgam. Like many other countries Switzerlands official line is that Amalgams are not a problem.

My "normal" dentist is very good and very professional but he doesn't take any special measures. When asked directly about amalgam his answer is that "it is an inferior product for filling teeth" and thats that!

I do have the details of a chelation "expert" but I do not know how closely he follows Andy Cutlers protocols. I would be grateful for any info of other practitioners though and would love to hear your experiences. Do you have amalgam illness? self diagnosed, suspected or diagnosed by a medical proffessional?

At least I know I'm not the only mad wobbly health obsessed and concerned English speaking person in Switzerland!!!

Not that I am implying you are mad or wobbly of course!!!

10
Are you saying she uses the whole vitamin C IV type protocol .

My dentist used at least one of those plastic barriers so you do not swallow parts but he said the biggest problem is inhalation, and I presume the protocol cannot prevent us ingestion the Hg vapours, so what is left then that is important

Do you have Andy's book and would you recommend it? I am asking because it is quite expensive and would have to come from the US if I buy one .

PS Not sure about the rest but I want to get rid of my enormous Hg fillings before trying to conceive, Hg is pretty damaging to developing nervous systems!

11
No, not vitamin C. I am not certain exactly which precautions as I haven't had a reply from her to my questions, but I have been told that there are things other than the "rubber dam" which can dramatically reduce your exposure, such as a separate oxygen supply, high quantities of cold water n stuff. Your dentist is correct in saying that the vapours are the biggest problem.

Most normal dentists use the dental dam these days anyway and it's a start. Even taking all the precautions in the world can't reduce exposure to vapours by 100% but obviouly the more the better.

You really should read Andy's book. There are also yahoo groups devoted to this topic and of course other books. What he writes and advocates makes perfect sense to me though. When I was looking for this book I found it at Amazon and some other places at a ridiculous price. If you go to his website www.noamalgam.com you can purchase it there. It is MUCH cheaper and I received mine in a few days!

I would suggest you read as much as you can before you get your fillings removed but I also agree totally with your desire to get them out before you conceive! Mercury crosses the placenta as easily as anything and I am actually just finding out that my two children are probably suffering from all the problems they have because of me passing the mercury to them when I was pregnant.

You just have to learn as much as you can and make your own decisions. It is really good to know that you are taking an interest now before you have children and also before you get ill!

Some people are more sensitive to Mercury than others. So one person can have one amalgam filling and get very sick. Another person can have one filling and be fine. The simple facts remains though, that Mercury is the second most toxic substance on the planet, it is treated as hazerdous waste before and after it's put in your mouth, vapour does leek from amalgam fillings, it does lodge in your organs including your brain and it will eventually do some degree of harm to every person who has it in them.

Ooops, sorry - going off on one there! I am quite passionate about it, as you can probably tell!

The trouble is I feel like the only English speaking person in Switzerland who is going through all this - very lonely. It's nice to know that I can offer a little advice to someone else though.

12
Had a quick look at some evidence such as reported by BBC There are far more risky things to become passionate about.

Don't have your amalgam fillings replaced either recommends the British Dental Health Foundation.

dave

13
Good call. Why are people unable to manage risk objectively?

What's the odds that some of the people wanting to remove mercury above either smoke, skydive or have a wood burning stove...

14
Or perhaps all three . I remember the whole British beef/BSC carry-on (was living in the UK at the time). Smokers would sit there puffing away saying "No way, wouldn't touch that beef". The Economist did an excellent story a while back about how humans treat risk. We underplay the most heavy risks (e.g. smoking, driving a car), but overplay the most minute of risks (going out shopping for fear of being hit by a sniper in Washington, eating BSE-infested beef, letting our children out of the house, etc.) It is a curious side of human nature.

15
I judge this by the total body of scientific evidence, not merely one study. It is the same evidence Scandinavian and other countries used to consider a ban on amalgam fillings full stop and in the mean time impose restrictions i.e., not for children, pregnant women, people with kidney problems, and in people with mercury sensitivity. Even in the US, one third of the dentists in the US are apparently currently 'mercury free.'

Governments do their research before they impose restrictions and consider permanent bans. Other nations are just behind, a bit like the 'no smoking in public places' paradigm.

In Dave's link, the British DHF says this:

That is why I am having them removed now, well ahead of time.

Anyway, wanted to add that there is probably no fence sitting on this topic, like the non-smoking issue perhaps. Either you are a sceptic, or you are not, and you believe the scientific evidence that indicates that for many people, and certainly women of childbearing age and for children, mercury fillings should be avoided. To each his personal reckoning but I am with Cheeseonion on this one.

(If you want some facts, read a few abstracts on PubMed and the like).

16
I know nothing about this mercury business, and since I have no fillings I've never really thought about it. But I do disagree with that statement. Governments don't always do their research before imposing bans and restrictions. GM plants/food is a fantastic example of that.

Yes, they often do their research, but not always. Therefore I don't think it is necessarily a conclusive example to point to a particular government's actions as proof of something.

17
I fully respect the folk on the other side of the fence. I was there once too and would love to be able to go back. However, I can not unknow what I know! I am passionate about many things, but my survival, health and that of my children has to be the most important.

And indeed, many people can not "manage risk objectively". I for one certainly can and do. But I will not bury my head in the sand or follow the crowd and beleive everything I am told.

Unfortunately, Governments can only say so much publically because otherwise they would be totally s*****d. There are more and more PROVEN cases of amalgam poisoning every year and will continue to be so for many decades to come. If they were to admit that amalgam fillings are dangerous they would probably be bankrupt. Oh and by the way, once you understand the chemistry of mercury and it's effects on human tissue, enzymes, neurological development, brain cells etc etc you will find it very difficult to ever doubt it's dangers. It has been proven that the mercury from your fillings finds its way into your organs very quickly indeed. You might be a lucky person and not suffer from that - yet - or there again you might be dramatically unlucky.

Putting your trust in the BDA is like putting your trust in the government that fed the remains of a diseased animal to another vegetarian animal and said that that wouldn't be harmful. Government research did a good job of that didn't they? Peruse through all the other stupid things governments have done.

If you are interested there are many world renouned scientific geniuses who developed things like Penicillin for example. That particular chap was initially treated like an idiot. no one believed him!

I could say so, so much here but that's not why I am here. I do not have the energy to fight for the cause to people who are not genuinely interested in knowing the truth. I am only looking for likeminded people and my pressing need for personal reasons is to find the help I need here in Switzerland.

I have spent hours and hours of time into researching this topic and trying to decide whether it is scaremongering or a true problem. The evidence is all there. For anyone who is genuinely interested the evidence for the case is far and away greater than the "evidence" against. Unless you or someone you know has illness caused by heavy metals, and in particular mercury - although there are other less controversial ones, you will probably never understand how evil it is.

Incidentally, there are many highly esteemed Doctors, Dentists and other health practitioners who need no further convincing of the dangers of Amalgam fillings. My own Doctor was actually astounded when I explained that dental care was free when I was pregnant - that's why I had several fillings done or replaced. (Mercury of course because I didn't know any better and because that was what the good old NHS insisted on.)

My two children now have severe hormonal problems, life threatening actually and a collection of symptoms strongly indicative of mercury toxicity which they could only have got from me when I was pregnant.

Yes it can be dangerous to have them removed - sorry, it IS dangerous, but as MUZE7 is now doing, you must weigh up the potential dangers with the benefits. Done in the safest way possible it is the sensible option. Muze7 will read the research and make up his/her own mind. Surely better than trusting one documentary or the ramblings of the government, or the BDA or the BMA.

It's about peace of mind and wanting the best for you own offspring.

cheesenonion

18
You are probably more likely to improve your survivability by buying a fluorescent jacket to avoid being hit by a car - but then again the emitted radiation from the paint on the jacket...

Pick a substance: any substance. I could find you a list of medical reports of reasonable providence that describe the dangers of said substance.

Life's too short. I can provide with a list of "things to worry about" if your have too much time on your hands

dave

I'm sure the British Medical Association will be well impressed with your assessment of their output...

19
Dave, either you didn't bother reading my last post thoroughly or you are just one of those people who like to wind others up on these groups and try to get their feathers ruffled. z

Whatever your needs or desires, I don't think this thread has much to do with you anyway. I am not going to bother wasting my time even reading your postings on this subject.

You obviously have nothing better to do and far too much time on YOUR hands!

Chao

cheesenonion

20
I know two people who have "Chelated" (don't know the exact details but will get them to you) and has reduced the levels of heavy metals to a normal level. It is very worth while!! keep it up