I'm a US student in my 12th grade year looking to attend ETH Zurich, but am not sure how I should do this. I want to study Physics and Electrical Engineering, obtaining a PhD in physics and masters in electrical engineering.
I do not know how to speak German, so I'm going to take the year or two after I graduate high school learning how to speak it and going to my state university (Oregon State University).
Please help me, I'm not sure if this is the correct route I should be taking to get into ETH Zurich. Any advice? Or questions I should be answering/asking?
Do you think you can get in to ETH? I have no idea what the admissions requirements are, especially for foreign students, but I was under the impression it is a sought after place to study
Please use the search function of the forum, this topic has been discussed ad nauseam elsewhere. Furthermore, the admissions page of the ETH has a section in English that explains what the entry requirements are. From what you describe, I'm afraid you may have to consider a different option, as you will really struggle to reach the required standard of German and I'm a bit worried if you were not able to find this basic information yourself - ETH is extremely competitive and I know fluent German-speakers who have chosen to go elsewhere because they felt they were not up to the very intense study course that involves kicking out a large percentage of students in their first year.
If you are trying to enter at Master level, then the situation may be different, as many of those courses are in English, however, I believe they have a cap on the admissions and again, you will be expected to know everything that was taught at ETH in the Bachelor part of the Masters degree.
May I ask what is drawing you to ETH specifically? Many who have asked the same questions as you were drawn by the very low study fees, which I understand, however, you have to factor in that you would be living in one of the most expensive countries in the world, in a culture that is very different from the one you know and where people can seem very cold to "foreign folk".
In general this forum is an excellent source of information, but I believe that for University admissions contacting either the specific institution or the CRUS is a more efficient approach.
And note that, as Drmom has stated, ETH is a highly competitive school, the MIT of Europe.
Good luck, whatever you decide!
Added: While I was composing my reply Kittster posted an excellent reply.
First, I think it would be helpful to elaborate on the reasons why you'd like to go to the ETH specifically. There are plenty of schools in the US that are excellent for your chosen fields.
I also wouldn't recommend the ETH for an American who is living in the US for the following reasons (and, I'm American, so these are not meant to insult...)
-Language. It's one thing to learn conversational German and quite another to go through oral exams in German.
-Cost. Although tuition is quite low at the ETH, the cost of living is very high.
-Culture. There is no on-campus social life to speak of here, and the classes are spread between the main campus, Irchel and Hoenggerberg. Many students commute (i.e. they live with their parents outside of Zurich), and it can be a lonely place if you don't have any friends here. Also, there is also nothing comparable to the extracurricular programs available at US Universities, nor are there any comparable humanities programs. Think hard about whether you really want to give up these influences, both in classes and in terms of the people you'll get to know.
Other issues:
Because you would only need German for the bachelor's degree (at least in Physics, the PhD program is in English), you are probably better off completing your undergraduate degree and masters in the US and then applying to the PhD program.
And finally, you haven't even started college yet. Are you sure you really want to do a PhD in Physics and a masters in EE?
hehehe sorry, when I read the post title, this is all I can think of:
But seriously, the Bachelors program here is very hard. Do note, for Swiss citizens everyone who finishes their matura (aka highschool final exams) is guaranteed entrance to ETH. Thus the first year is very hard with a 50% failure rate. Bachelors programs are in German, grad programs are in English. I highly suggest doing the undergrad in the US and then coming here for the masters or PhD.....if that's still the plan.
I want to immerse myself in a completely different culture and language, and go through an immense academic challenge. I'm kind of a masochist in that aspect I suppose, I really enjoy having a ridiculously hard course load, at least when I'm learning about things that I enjoy. ETH would give me both, I would be at one of the most challenging universities in the world and be able to experience a completely different culture for years. I'm not worried that I wont have any friends for awhile, or that there is no social life on campus. That is fine with me.
Thank you for welcoming me!
ETH being a competitive school is one of the reasons why I think I would love it, and want to go.
I don't only want to learn German because I want to attend ETH, I have some interest in learning different languages. I would like to speak it fluently. I'm not really concerned with extracurriculars. I'm 100% sure that those are the fields I want to get degrees in haha.
Lol, nice picture. I know it will be hard, and that is one of the reasons why I want to go.
As far as a difficult course load and a change in culture are concerned, may I ask why you didn't consider MIT or another top program? These would be considerably more difficult than high school, and, trust me, MIT is like a whole different country. Also, if you have an interest in German, why haven't you been taking German classes in high school?
Apologies if this is harsh sounding, but it just seems like you haven't really thought this through very well. Languages! Engineering! Physics! a Masters in one subject and a PhD in another! These diverse interests are exactly what US Universities are good at-letting you try on different academic personalities and decide what suits you while still letting you graduate in a reasonable time period (liberal arts education).
While I think it's great that you enjoy hard work and I suspect the more we tell you you can't do it, the more stubborn you'll get, I'm not sure you quite understand what we mean by "hard". For starters, there is no "physics and engineering" at bachelor level, there is EITHER physics OR engineering. That is not "hard" to find out, yet it appears you haven't done so. At bachelor level you just do what everyone else does and try to survive. I have two incredibly bright, hard-working friends who grew up here (i.e. they speak fluent German) who failed ETH physics because, well, they couldn't hack it. Which is unsurprising, considering only 43% passed in the year that saw them fail.
To give you an idea of the workload - per term you have to obtain 30 credit points. Each credit point means at least 30 hours of work (the lecturer will base this on his own estimation of how long things take), term lasts about 15 weeks, so you are looking at a 60 hour week minimum. At the end of the first year you will have exams where they want to get rid of at least 50% of the students as more have joined than they have room for. Then as you carry on to the second/third year you will have exams at the end of every term.
You will need to have a "social" life to survive, I used to date an ETH maths student and I am friends with several who did physics, having a network is the winning formula from what I can tell.
One last thing - if you want to learn to speak German, I would advise that you go to the Technische Universität München, which is at a similar standard as the ETH. We don't actually speak German in Switzerland, at least not in day to day interactions among each other, which is sometimes a great grievance to Germans, never mind those who speak German as a second language. But then ETH has a lot of Germans so maybe it's a bit "better" there.
Language is only a side-interest haha, not something I want to fully pursue and get a degree in. I did take German classes in my high school for the first two years, but the instructor didn't teach anything. It was a class where everyone goes off task and the instructor didn't care.
I wouldn't be able to get into MIT, I did not do well my first two years of high school and as a result my overall GPA is not above a 3.3. So, basically, I doubt they would accept me. I'm still going to apply though. Physics and EE are my main interest, and have been the past 3 years. Anything else isn't as important to me. I've been taking EE classes at a local community college since 2 years ago and I've grown to love it.
You're right, I haven't really planned this out. But, that is why I posted here. Hopefully I'll have it planned out soon though.
Thanks-I was pretty sure that the idea of a "double major" or a "major and a minor" didn't exist at the ETH, but I couldn't find a definitive source.
I also agree about the social life-it's very hard to do well in any sort of challenging program without a good social net-it's not an ETH-specific requirement, but finding friends here can be especially hard here. What is definitely not unique is the difficulty of the program. There are plenty of challenging programs in Physics in the US, and some will allow a minor in EE or a double major (though this is probably not a good idea in the first place).
It sounds like you're under the impression that you'd have a better chance of being accepted to the ETH (which requires German fluency-which you don't have) than to a top program in the US. Based on the language requirements, the general problems with valuation of a US high school diploma, and the size of the ETH program, I would guess that this is a mistaken impression. No doubt MIT is harder to get into (there's a larger pool of applicants), but there are other choices in the US.
Okay, so obviously you'd need to ace your SATs. Also, how good are your community college grades? Do you have a mentor who can write you an excellent letter of recommendation? Have you participated in any research? Can you extend the other classes you'll be needing (especially math-you'll need to be past multivariable calculus and ready for linear algebra in order to be comfortable with the requirements at top programs)?
Basically, depending on your situation, you shouldn't count yourself out of a great program in the US. I've sat on admissions interview boards, and GPA doesn't count as much as you might think. An upward trend is very important, as is a demonstrated commitment to your academic progress. If I were you, I'd spend this time researching the top 20 programs for physics or engineering (and I'd seriously pick one, at least for now), determine what the SAT score you'd need to get in and work on that, rather than trying to learn German to come here (where your qualifications won't count as much and you'll be behind the other students simply due to language).
My excuse is that my family has had a difficult time going through divorce and unemployment. And, they were never really supportive of me and school and what not, so I wasn't ever really sure about what I should be doing. But that's just an excuse.
Last year (my 11th grade year) I started bringing my grades up to B's and A's. This year I'm taking a 25 credit course load at the local community college, maintaining a 4.0, while being in the high school's top-symphony band and jazz band.
I've already taken multi-variable calc, vector calc and differential equations at my community college and aced all of them. By the end of winter I'll have completed linear algebra and exhausted my community college of all of it's math courses. I haven't participated in any research, and am in the process of doing my SATs. I have a couple mentors who would be willing to write me awesome letters of recommendation.
The other school want to attend is Georgia Institute of Technology, it has an excellent program for me. But I would still like to go to ETH.
In light of this your best bet is to get your bachelors in the USA then come to Switzerland for a Master's. But you will need excellent grades.
Even get your Master's in the USA and if you are still a gluten for punishment go for the PhD. Maybe try and spend a semester or part of your Master's at the ETH. Most PhD positions are given to people the professors already know.
Honestly, your basic situation sounds like the type of thing school admissions committees like to hear (except you'll have to drop the part about your family not being supportive). They love the "underdog who overcomes" sort of story. Also, the extracurriculars are great, especially if your bands do all-state competitions (or if you compete as a soloist). This kind of back story can make a huge difference-it's far more impressive to have done well in the context of personal difficulty.
Ace your SATs. Get the letters. Apply early admissions to your top choices. Find a backup school or two. You'll be fine.