Is this normal? Our dog in a 'wohnquartier'.

Family, Education, Health and Pets
1
We moved to Oberaegeri, Zug - me and my Swiss husband and my dog. She is medium sized, very obedient, doesn't even need the leash to go with me...Soon I realized that in this village there are nearly no places where you can go to walk your dog. Everything is private or it ends up in a private property. So instead of three walks I started to do just two, a shorter one in the morning to the sea and a long one in the late afternoon into the hills and woods far above the village. For this second walk I usually need 1.5 hours...

In the attempt to keep the gallbladder of my dog healthy I take her into the grass which is just in front of our terrace around midday and she pees there about one or two times. It is a potential playground for children but not used since there is another one in front of the house as well...And the meadow is large, so probability that somebody steps into where she just peed is rather zero.

Anyway today we got a letter the we use the grass area as a dog toilet and she should actually be on a leech and so on and so on. The agency who is taking care of our houses doesn't want to tell us who was complaining so we cannot talk to anybody and ask what the real problem is.

I cannot believe that this can be a problem - especially when we asked about the dog before we moved in...It feels horrible for me to be "observed" but not talked to and also this crazy need for things to look nice but not being used...Is it just this one crazy village or do you have a similar experience? How do you walk your dog in Switzerland? I nearly feel like leaving this country because I cannot imaging having this every day...

2
Dog Lovers VS. Dog Haters war starting in 3... 2... 1...

3
Don't take this as an attack, just my observation as someone with kids (who isn't Swiss).

I would also object very strongly to your dog peeing on the shared grass in the development; the point about it not being used as a play area is moot - the dog doing this prevents that happening nicely in future.

The Swiss are hot on not letting rules slip, because it's nearly impossible to go back; I have some sympathy for this position.

I'm surprised you can't find a street with a verge somewhere nearby given it's a small village and always looks pretty green when I've driven through, maybe somebody on the forum can give a specific location.

4
it's all private here...except of a park at the lake where your walk is finished in about 7.5 minutes.

I'm not sure whether it is about children or not..I was just trying to describe the area, it is just a meadow in-between houses but it doesn't say what it really is. Except of that every flat at the ground floor uses the meadow in front of their terrace for its purposes.

I'm more surprised with the way of communication, I mean via an agency rather then personally...

5
New Around Here, Are You?

6
Ah, yes that is normal.

That doesn't mean the majority of people wouldn't approach you personally and probably politely - just the majority of complainers, who of course make up the vast vast majority of individual complaints.

I'd speak to you face-to-face , and also suggest anywhere I'd seen that may be more appropriate - but I'm in the wrong village...

7
Can't you get a litter tray for your dog and put it on your terrace?

After all, you don't consider the dog urine to be a problem for others so it probably won't be for you too.

8
Linda, I am sorry to hear that you are having trouble - but what has happened to you is indeed common.

I have had many dogs here in Switzerland, had wonderful neighbors who truly accepted me and delighted in my dogs, and have had the neighbors from hell who instituted a mobbing campaign, even tried to kill my dogs. So I empathize, I honestly do. Whether you live happily here with dogs is a roll of the 'neighbors' dice.

However, the best way - no, the only way - we can give our dogs a good life here in Switzerland is to understand that the onus is on us, the dog owners, to adjust to local norms.

Part of that is understanding that while dogs have the right to an 'artgerecht' life here in Switzerland under the federal animal welfare law, the 'gotcha' is that no one has the right to have a dog - and so there is no obligation to provide for our dogs from public resources. We must do this privately. If we do not have the appropriate private property to give our dogs what they need, then we dog owners have to go above and beyond to make sure we find a way to live in harmony with our neighbors.

So - yes, your neighbors are well within their rights to complain. You should not allow your dog to urinate on common ground in a residential area.

If you don't have a private garden you'll need to get creative. And in dealing with the neighbors, you need to be proactive.

First, contact the landlord to find out where exactly you may allow your dog to urinate. Offer to pay for whatever maintance might be required. Hopefully there might be a small strip away from any grassy areas. You will need to train your dog to use this area, and only this area. Training a dog to urinate on command (assuming the dog is healthy) is actually fairly easy. Carry a watering can with you and water in the area after your dog has urinated to reduce damage or smell.

If there is nowhere that you may use within 'reasonable bladder distance' from your house, then you will need to drive somewhere. In your area, the walks along Raten Pass to Gotschalkenberg or in the other direction to St Jost are paradise for dogs.

Second, send a letter to all your neighbors acknowledging their concerns. Appologize for not having understood the house rules, and now that you do you are working on training your dog. If you are active in a Hundeschule mention this, as knowing that you are in 'official' training goes a long way to getting neighbors off your back. If the landlord has given you permission to use one specific spot then state that to head off future complaints. Ask the neighbors to come directly to you with any concerns so that you can address them. Be polite, not defensive.

If this doesn't work - likely you will have to move in order to have a 'normal' life with your dog. Look for a home or flat with your own private garden. A private garden doesn't stop all the difficulties, but it makes them so much more manageable.

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But after you have taken proactive steps, try not to stress too much. Take your dog up to Raten Pass - it's one of the more beautiful walks in the area, especially just as the sun is rising. You'll likely meet many kindred souls walking their dogs - hopefully some will become friends.

Wishing you all the best.

9

This is the real problem believe it or not. Swiss dog ownership is very strict and there are many rules and regulations from federal right down to gemeinde level that you need to know about. Do you know you need to do a mandatory SKN theory and practical dog ownership course? If not, then the answer is yes you do regardless of how many years you may have owned a dog unless you get an exemption from the cantonal veterinary office. Do you know what the gemeinde rules are for dogs, i.e. do they have to be on a lead at all times, they have to wear a muzzle, etc? These are things that you as a dog owner must find out and adhere to.

If you can take your dog out on to the grass can you not take her a bit further out on to the road or a paved area where any urine could run off harmlessly?

10
We nearly moved to Oberägeri but chose Unter. We scoped out the dog walking possibilities and there where lots so it wouldn't be an issue for our chochy cherubs could 'stretch there legs' as that is a primary concern for us.

I can certainly understand why other residents would be pee'd off (pun intended) with you letting you dog pee on communal areas close to the apartments. The chosen method of complaint is almost always indirect via the letting agents so don't concern yourself about it, just draft a letter back to the agents saying sorry, ask them to distribute it, and chose another spot

11
I have dogs, well, only one now, and I don't even let them pee on my own grass near the patio/kitchen door- as a/ it smells and b/ it kills the grass- and because we have a lot of children who come to play here. I think it's nothing 'Swiss' - just makes sense.

12
In sŵitzerland there are restrictions on where a dog can pee?

Wow, that's mad.

Picking up poo makes sense but controlling your dogs bladder?

13
we are talking about peeing on private shared property here. Would you let your dog pee on your neighbours doormat (or yours?) or on someon's balcony, or yours? Or in the middle of your kitchen? No you train your dog to 'hold' until you are in an appropriate place.

14
You can always try to teach your dog urinating not just on the grass. My pup likes all sorts of ground drains .

15
Thank you Melanchollie, this was very helpful. I was at Raten many times, but since I'm also working I cannot do it every day. But really thanks for the explanation. It helps me to see that this is just normal here. I'm from a country where there is not such a shortage on space, that's maybe the problem :-).

16
Thank you, yes, I know about the training and so on, that is not a problem. I also know the gemeinde rules. Thank you!

17
Thanks a lot papa Goose :-) Yes, Unteraegeri is much better for dog walking, it's actually another planet for dog walking.

The grass I was talking about is very big, it is not close to any flat except of ours (but it is still 50, 60 metres) and the neighbor who said the very first day she doesn't ming the dog doing anything and her kids are playing with her. I wouldn't let her pee next to any others door or something, it's a common sense for me. We discussed it with the agent again and we probably know who it was, funnywise a family who has a huge Berner dog barking all day long in the flat. Well. :-)

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Thanks a lot to everybody for reactions, it was very helpful

19
Yes, that many parts of Switzerland are so overcrowded, that we live packed together like sardines in a can*, is indeed the root of the problem. There is little private space, all but the lucky few have no option but to live communally - meaning we have to think of others at all times, adjust our behavior.

For those of us from countries where more personal space and more laissez-faire attitudes are common, the adjustments we must make here can come as quite a shock. 'Swiss normal' wouldn't even be on our radar back home so we often don't even realize we have committed some sort of faux pas until the anonymous notes appear.

And overcrowded conditions often bring out the worst in people. I see my corner of Switzerland as a sort of Calhounian sink.

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I lived in the US, with the typical surburban large house and huge garden - and trained my dogs to that particular set of expectations. I also lived in crowded Hong Kong, but had much more private space - and privacy - than I do here. Coupled with a far more live-and-let-live societal norm - again, I trained my dogs to those particular expectations. And now I have to train my dogs to crowded conditions and the 'alles unter die Lupe Kontrolle' expectations of my Swiss neighbors.

Swiss expectations can be hard to grasp at first, as most of us have not lived in this kind of fish bowl atmosphere before. No, let me correct that: one's particular Swiss neighborhood's expectations can be hard to grasp - because you will soon learn that the only thing one can count on in Switzerland is that everything differs by canton, Gemeinde, Quartier, building - and roll of the nice neighbor vs neighbor-from-hell dice.

Many of us dog owners have had to deal with these kinds of clashes of expectations - part of the integration process. Or something. One thing I would suggest is that since your husband is Swiss let him be the point man in dealing with neighbors.

Wishing you all the best.

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* Except in Ticino.

20
Thanks Meloncollie...I'm happy not to be the only one to feel this.

Well, I'm actually Czech, but lived with my dog in Spain and Ireland for quite long times as well...so my experiences are wide enough...This again is something new and it still feels rather ridiculous. Plus people having this governmentally required dog training but never allowing the dogs to meet and snuffle on each other anyway...very strange to me.

But yes, I will adapt and find a way how to live here, but this most probably will be one of reasons why the stay will not be for ever :-) thanx for your time!