As drremobond007 has said, the more rural areas are less popular (no big cultural events, no city buzz, no bars, no clubs, no gym, no status, etc.) and so young doctors don't tend to want to go and work there. For someone coming from abroad, this can be a plus, if one is prepared to go rural.
Perhaps this post could help you, too: https://www.englishforum.ch/3266212-post113.html . Look up all the clinics and hospitals, and see which departments they do and don't have. Then watch their vacancies, over six months or so. That will show you the pattern.
Hey man
Honestly, I donāt know how competitive patho branch is... I can understand your situation but you need contact FMH if you wanna know in advance.
Try to read or translate the pdf for pathology on SIWF website (see in my last reply). They explained everything about categories based on a lot of factors in general patho & cytopathology (on Page 10 of PDF precisely).
Initially, look at the requirements, if you are fulfilling them or not for directly applying to patho. (grade of cat.: A>B>C>D; Cat. A being best hospitals and longest duration accounting for specialisation) At the beginning as EU med. graduate, you need to apply in cat. B or C >> gain experience >> apply in cat A hospitals.
If you still havenāt understood category system; read in internal medicine PDF.
Good night
Khalid
Youāre absolutely right... Reality doesnāt reflect as on paper..! My overtime (almost 68hrs) accumulated over last 5 months, was recently compensated. But still these circumstances are better than in my home country: less hectic working situations, well compensated, etc.
VSAO (with FMH representatives) is doing great job in this regard by checking the loopholes// controlling the institutions with surprise visits & survey with AssitenzaĢrzte & OberaĢrzte etc. We had one in December 2020 ... hahaha
Anyways... Good night
Khalid
I am a Canadian who is married to an EU citizen. I am studying medicine in the EU and will graduate next year in June, hopefully. I would really like to practice medicine in Switzerland. I want to do my residency there but I have no idea where to begin from.
I speak a little bit of German and French, but not fluently. I am more than willing to learn. Does anyone have any tips or ideas? I would even go to the most rural areas. I am trying to sort this out before I graduate so that I won't be stuck with no job.
As far as I understand the extensive advice from drremobond007, he's set out a flow-chart. You start at the base line, and work through the branch of the process that is applicable to you: EU, non-EU citizenship, EU, non-EU qualification, and so on. As soon as you encounter a step in the process he's outlined that can't work for you, re-trace your steps and see whether you'd be able to follow a different line out of all the possibilities.
Having lived in Switzerland for some years I can say that I've never yet heard of a doctor being unemployed (unless they wanted to be so). After all, a considerable band of the current doctors working here now is now aged over 50, even over 60, and as they retire, while the Swiss life-expectancy continues to increase, we are approaching a severe crisis of undersupply of medical doctors, nurses and other medical practitioners. That is why Switzerland has found ways to open up to employing medical staff from abroad.
I have, however, heard of doctors who didn't immediately get a placement module in the specific field in which they were aiming to specialise. In that case, they took a 6-month job in another field that could also be interesting, while building up their network to re-enter their preferred specialisation. This can even be a good idea: having temporarily worked in another field can later enrich one's work in one's field of specialisation.
In your specific case, I think you need to weigh up which is more important to you: "get myself into Switzerland to be able to work there" or "become a pathologist by the shortest route possible". That equation will, of course, depend in part not only on the conditions for doctors here in Switzerland, but also on your options in the country in which you now live, and on other countries which would accept you.
Good luck with your decisions.
At the risk of sounding a little tired, I'd like to recommend that you take the time to work through all the extensive advice already set out in this remarkable thread by drremobond007. He really has done wide research, for which I salute him.
Practically, you start in lower categories and move up all the way to cat. A.
I assume, you haven't read page 10 on patho PDF on www.siwf.ch . For more details about categories, please read PDF.
In Switzerland, it's quite simple if you are unsatisfied with your branch or your boss/ OAĢ(/OA) or hospital management, or anything = change job/hospital in different category /branch
Usually cat A have a lot of patient load with complex clinical scenarios: So, HR or HOD of cat. A are very picky about hiring especially when AAĢ are in direct contact with patients. In such circumstances, swiss & native german speakers will always have preference over non german speaking doctors (for non EU doctors: the more fluent one speaks, the better are chances). Then plays a lot of other factors (but very little role) like degree recognition, already in Switzerland or paper work like resident permit etc. These little factors won't stop you from getting hired (if already in Switzerland), but surely important for excelling faster.
Simple method & basic logic: one changes hospital after getting confirmation from the next hospital.
As I told earlier in this thread, once you exceeds the duration of particular branch at a particular clinic/hospital in specific category. Let's say pathology Weiterbildung in cat. C at Viollier AG in Allschwil is 12 months & your work contract is for unlimited term), you have worked there for 24 months & you get a job in cat. B. Now, at end of your tenure, you'll get a work experience certificate & full monthly salary for 20months. But your Weiterbildung/ specialisation duration will be allowed & counted just for 12 months, as each AA has to enter/ get attested the draft (hard as well as soft copy) of his elogbook from each working hospital let's say here Viollier AG.
It became too lengthy. Hopefully you have your answers.
Khalid
Do you know if it is possible to submit the application for degree recognition to MEBEKO without a B2 language certificate yet? I can't remember where I read this, but I seem to have the impression that you can apply for recognition first and then add the language certificate later (still working on my German proficiency.... )
And, with regards to:
"BestaĢtigung Minimalanforderungen
ā¢ Kopie einer BestaĢtigung mit Originalbeglaubigung, dass Ihr im Ausland erworbenes Diplom auf
einer Ausbildung beruht, welche die folgenden Minimalanforderungen erfuĢllt:
- a. fuĢr AĢrztinnen und AĢrzte: eine Ausbildungsdauer von mindestens sechs Jahren
Vollzeitstudium oder 5'500 Stunden theoretischen und praktischen Unte"
Did you also manage to get this letter from your university? It is a bit frustrating for me as I haven't been able to get this from mine (I suppose corona is to blame...). To add to the frustration, my medical degree is from the EU so I'm not sure if I still need to do this step - I wish I was eligible for the indirect recognition route but I have been practising outside the EU for the last 10 years, so it appears that I wouldn't be eligible as I would need to have been practising in the EU for the last 3 years
Thank you!
You are welcome
As I know & did for my GL registration process, they needed german certificate along with other documents. So, I guess, they will ask during recognition process too.
Yes, I got it from my medical college/university. I made the format myself & got it reprint from my university, as needed by MEBEKO.
I think, if you hold a degree from EU: it should be directly or indirectly recognised, without going through the long STAATSEXAM process..! I would suggest you to contact MEBEKO, as it will be the best & fastest way to get answers to these queries (for this special situation).
Hopefully, you have all your answers.
Khalid
Really appreciate all the help people are giving to those of us looking for a new life abroad.
I am a British doctor hoping to move to Geneva in August. At this point I will have completed 2 years as a doctor (my foundation years)
Annoyingly due to covid my french B2 exam has been postponed and although I am confident of passing I will now be sitting my exam on May 9th and wont recieve my results until June 30th. I will actually sit the C1 exam in June too.
Once I have my language certificate I can ask MEBEKO to recognise my degree/join the online register.
Any idea how long this registration process usually takes? And is there any advice for any work I could get in the meantime or ways to speed it up so i'm not just sitting around doing nothing for months. Is there any point in applying for jobs even if I haven't joined the register yet or will potential employers think that's a waste of time?
I will be able to work, and visa wont be a problem. I have been assured that the UK and Switzerland have an agreement about degree recognition lasting until 2024 even though the UK has recently left the EU.
Thanks for any advice in advance.
You could check whether you meet the admission requirements for voluntary work (at various levels, not only medical) at MeĢdecins Sans FrontieĢres in Geneva
https://medecinssansfrontieressuisse...anees-au-siege
Some hospitals provide a welcome service for patients at admission. In some cases, this is done by volunteers. You could ask at all the various hospitals in your area whether they still provide this help, and whether that's a task you could take on. It would give you insight into the way a Swiss hospital is run. See, for example, here: https://www.divisionprivee-hug.ch/vo.../votre-accueil
Another area for self-study would be the way that Swiss insurances work: the obligatory medical/health insurance, general/basic, semi-private and private. Ditto accident insurance. Then also the Swiss state insurances for disability and old-age, and how the employers' pension plans work. This is general knowledge for your own life, but could be essential for your patients, once you are called upon to assess and report upon their needs.
Good luck as you make the move!
Youāre welcome.
Due to recent changes in specialization structure in UK, I donāt know but I assume foundation years are basic 2 years of medical residency/ specialization.
It is great news for you that despite BREXIT your degree will be directly recognised. In your case, GL number/degree registration & degree recognition shall take place simultaneously.
Both of them (together) takes around 2-3months to process.
As Khaled mentioned: yes, itās possible. So, I would suggest: apply for degree recognition as soon as possible.
As far as I know, French part is little more competitive for job (lesser PG hospitals, more French speaking candidates etc). Assuming you will be joining specialization here: try to filter out hospitals (offering specialization in Geneva) & preferred branch on https://www.siwf-register.ch/
I would suggest: Start applying for job in these hospitals. (Rest of the details, please read in this thread, I have mentioned somewhere).
Mention about your B2 & C1 exam in your job application letter as well as in CV.
During your job interview (these days: just online), you can reason/ explain them about the delay in your (degree) recognition or acquiring B2/C1 French certificate.
In Switzerland, it takes usually around 1.5-2 months from job application till signing a work contract. It might vary in French part.
All the best
Khalid
I wanted to ask if I'm a non EU citizen who graduated from a non EU medical school, would having full GMC registration (i.e. from UK) benefit me in any way? I am able to apply for full registration with GMC, would that alter the recognition pathway I am able to apply through? i.e. would I still need to apply to the pathway where my diploma is unrecognized?
Thank you.