Moving to Lugano from Ireland

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1
Hi everyone,

I am planning to move to Lugano, Ticino, I have thought about Zurich but my gut feeling tells me to try Lugano, Ticino, because my wife is very sceptical of living in a German speaking city, she loves Italy and good weather. I also love Italy and good weather but we also like a proper structured and transparent system with a good quality of life, so Lugano seems to have the upper hand.

What I want to ask is part of the reason why Switzerland as a whole might not be for us, but maybe Ticino is better in that perspective and it is Noise, noise restrictions, regulations.

I know I won't be able to live in a house but I am not prepared to live in what seems to be the rule of thumb, in a poor soundproofed apartment where I would be restricting from flushing the toilets and do household tasks during the night and Sundays as well as other restrictions which I find very extreme, but at the same time a necessary evil in CH taking into consideration the type of buildings they have.

Is Ticino any different being an Italian Speaking region, do they have the same noise restrictions and are the apartments of the same soundproof standards as in the rest of Switzerland?

Not that I am noisy, but for me flushing the toilet in the middle of the night or putting the laundry, vacuum cleaning and listening to music and watching TV at a moderate level at night is not an issue for me or to any of my friends who live in apartments in Ireland because you just won't hear your neighbour doing these chores, they are properly build to avoid these types of inconvenience.

I ask this important question, because as minuscule as it might appear is a big deal for me and my family since we are used to live free in harmony without very strict noise restrictions and I want to move to Switzerland if I am sure I will blend well and integrate with society, no point in me moving knowing that I will be causing nuance to neighbours, as quiet as noiseless as I am, I might be consider an impolite loud person in CH, so I want to make things right and know well before I make the big decision, in the end, I want to move because I want to and not because I need to

Thanks!

2
I've been living in Switzerland for over 15 years now and still loving it. Although I live in the German part in Zurich city and recently near Zurich, I have family in Ticino and in Vaud (French part).

Ticino is the Sunshine state (or Canton if you like) it's beautiful. Great weather, fantastic food, wonderful atmosphere with the Swiss efficiency, yet still has that Italian lifestyle. You can have a great life there, and you will have to learn Italian and become accustomed to their way of life and customs. The locals there are generally more relaxed than in the north.

From my experience, most of the English speakers live around Zurich, Zug Basel, Geneva and Lucerne. The so called financial hubs, and with that English community, comes stuff like English and Irish pubs, English movies at the cinemas and a lot of locals that can speak English (in the German part a lot of locals like to speak English, such as in shops, banks and importantly municipality officials that is if you ask first if they speak English).

Ticino on the other hand, English is the third or even forth language to the locals. Almost all Ticinese must learn German (which they hate speaking) or French, (they like that more) and lastly English. Naturally any tourist centre will also speak English. The point I'm trying to make is. Yes Ticino is fantastic but can be in some way, quite isolated. The main income is from tourism (German speaking tourism) or Italian private banking. Maybe someone that lives there can expand on that better than I can.

As for the toilet flushing rules... Yes they can exist, they are called 'house rules' and if you unlucky enough to live in an old place with conservative people living underneath you, they will complain and make life hell for you. On the other hand, I've never had any troubles from my neighbors and yes I make noise such as flushing toilets, having showers and listening to music with zero complaints in my old house at all times of the evening. The new building I live in is so well insulated that you could let off a bomb and no one would hear you. The modern houses and apartments are extremely high quality so you can flush away with out fear :-)

My father in law on the other hand lives in Canton Vaud in a building from the 70s, (not very good building quality) and yes after 10pm you are not allowed to flush or have a shower.

In short, it doesn't matter where you live in Switzerland, if you have cool neighbors those old fashioned rules aren't followed (unless you really over do it). On the other hand, if you have an old fashioned, grumpy,I hate the world neighbors. There are rules will make your life hell if you don't adjust.

I would focus on what is more important to you. Where you want to live and why you want to live there rather than the toilet flushing rules.

3
Hi SunSandSurf, thank you for your input. I know in Ticino I'll have to learn Italian and this is OK with me because besides being Irish I was also born in Venezuela from Spanish immigrants, my mother tongue is Spanish, but English is has been my everyday language for half my life, and my wife have family in Italy, I can already speak moderate Italian as I travel frequently to Italy and learning Italian for me is extremely easy.

You advised to to focus what is important to me, and hence my emphasis in the noise restriction and house rules enforcements. This simple matter portraits society as a whole and how people thinks and behaves. I love Italian as a language, is easy to me, the food, the better weather ad closeness to Italy and having the swiss efficiency and quality of life and this is what I want, but what I want the most is to be surrounded with nice people.

I believe what makes a country great is not just the excellent infrastructure and financial security, but their people, which is their greatest asset. Otherwise I could go to Dubai, but I am not after just material things but the human side.

If the toilet flushing thing is real and even in Ticino could be a case of getting lucky then is a real turn off for me because one of the great things Ireland has to offer which is why I am still here, despite the financial recession os their people, we live in houses and we respect our neighbours without the need of having strict common noise rules. The way I and most people think is that Sunday IS the day to mow your lawn and nothing makes us feels better than the smell of freshly cut grass on a Sunday morning, neighbours dogs barking and everyone blowing leafs in Autumn. Children playing on the streets doing what they do best.

The impression I am having is that none of these things I said would be possible and widely accepted as a way of life in Ticino. Before economic reward, whats more important to me is being surrounded by great neighbours who sticks together and help each other.

My neighbour even minds my boys for an hour or so if I have to do something important, not a bother, this is how close we are as neighbours.

If there is any hope of somewhat having this sort of lifestyle, being Ticino an Italian speaking region, more relaxed than the rest of Italy, I would be happy, but how Italianised and how Swissed is Ticino? That's my question. I wouldn't move to Italy anyways, I think they are on the other extreme of a more noisy and messy society which I wouldn't appreciate.

4
I can't address the specifics of Ticino, but house rules are common. The enforcement of said rules varies wildly, as does the occurrance of nutty neighbors.

We have plenty of house rules in our building, but people are pretty easy-going. We've still had noise from a dinner party after 10. Plenty of folks shower before 6 because they have to get to work. Toilets flush during the night. Heck, the Hauswart always mows the lawn between 12 and 2.

But - it is a newer building so the noise is not at all bothersome. There seem to be many more issues in the older buildings with paper-thin walls. If you are really worried about noise rules, just rent a flat that bills itself as child-friendly. Then you can be fairly certain noise is not only tolerated, but expected.

5

You in Switzerland can flush the toilet throughout the night, not however to use your hammer at nght, and not to play piano after 10pm

6
In Ticino, people are more relaxed (usually) about things.

But the public transportation system isn't up to the standards of the Swiss-German region. For example:

7
will you be working from home?

8
Hi Dack Rambo,

No I won't be working from home.

9
do you have a job lined up?

Ticino is very much a who-you-know place. Or you live over the border, commute 2 hours each way at the mercy of the traffic and get paid less than a local.

10
Hi Sean,

No Job lined up, I would only do the move if I find a job before hand. I would be looking from Ireland and travelling to Switzerland for interviews, I am not in a hurry, if it takes me a year or two is ok with me. I wouldn't live in Italy to save money in costs. I don't like unnecessary commuting and I want to live in Ticino, not in Italy. I would however shop in Italy

11
what industry are you in?

12

I'm in the Supply Chain / Procurement industry. I'm a Purchasing Manager and a Software Programmer as well

13
It could be that people here are easier going than on the north of the alps, but you will have to except and adapt to the way things are done here (err, i believe the word is integration) otherwise you will go nuts after 2 years and then sod off somewhere else ;-)

14

Exactly, integration is the key and my plan is to move to live and integrate, I like being involved in my community, hence my question about house rules. I don't know if is one of these things taken out of proportion being more of a myth or is it very extreme. I am quiet and I like quietness, but I have to find out how quiet is quiet in CH specially in Ticino and how easy going people are so I can be happy and make people around me happy as well.

An Irish person in Ticino would know exactly what I'm taking about and tell me if they felt the difference or if it was hard to adapt. A British person would know as well

15
I think you are putting too much emphasis on the silly things.

If your reason for not moving here is because you think you can't flush your toilet at night, rather than the good salaries, amazing landscapes, cleanliness and sometimes the food. Then perhaps you should broaden your horizons to other countries.

Also, you may only be able to do your washing once a month...

I am an Irish person in Geneva, i flush my toilet when i want, i play my music and tv up to a point where i would not annoy the neighbours, I respect my neighbours and they respect me. If one is going to have a loud party they let you know and vice a versa.

It's being polite. Not because there are some rules telling us to do this and not do that. It's not a prison.

16

I take your comment on board, if you say is ok with you then the noise thing might be an exaggeration and a myth for some reason. I have been told a lot of things and that's why I needed to clarify this matter, which is not silly to me.

The toilet flushing is a say, it covers the whole restriction package, but you seem to be doing OK and I concentrate in this silly thing because I just don't want to move to Switzerland for "the good salaries, amazing landscapes, cleanliness and sometimes the food" I have all this in Ireland, Swiss salaries are a bit better but not that much considering the cost of living, what I want is what I currently have plus better weather, more financial security in the long term, mountains to Ski and hike and the ease of travelling to other countries by car while not feeling restricted by what appears to be a miss informed subject which is the so famous Swiss noise approach.

And in this day and age, I think Switzerland would welcome people who do their homework and wants to move there because they really want to and not because they need to. When someone needs to move out of necessity it open the doors to extreme home sickness, which leads to social divisions, which leads to possibly ghettos, which leads to people having to hold referendums to stop minarets.

17
I second what has been said about the toilet thing by other users;

however, with regards to your favourite Sunday activities, Ticino would not be your place.

You can flush your toilet whenever you want (maybe they will call the doctor as they think you might have a problem after hearing it flush 100 times),

but you cannot make avoidable noise on a holiday, e.g (N.B. toilet flushing is not avoidable). You cannot force your personal view on things in and on a foreign country, expecting the locals to adapt. Ticino is a catholic canton, albeit liberal, and your direct neighbours, knowing that the only timelace you have is on Sunday, will probably close an eye, but generally one cannot even wash the car on a Sunday (exception made for gas stations, I think). Imho this would be a no-go in Ticino, but the concept behind is international.

18
the large majority of people here (also German and French parts) are normal humans. Don't let the occasional problem neighbor thread that you see on the forum worry you. The neighbor situation here might be even better than Ireland. For sure there's way less heavy drinking here and houses/apartments are generally of high quality.

19
I think the restrictions and extreme rules play a big part in integrating and feeling comfortable. I have felt it, its not the rules but how it makes you feel restricted and jailed sometimes.

I leave in Ticino for 7 years, it’s flipping a coin when it gets to what neighbors you get, and you can get the old unmarried lady that gets annoyed by everything and everyone, or the nice relaxed people that I got and leaved in my apartment for 5 happy years. If you do get the old lady, move out immediately, do not escalate don’t fight it, it’s a done deal.

May I give an idea though, My sister in law is Irish and my fiancé British, both couples leave in houses. You do not need to rent an apartment there are also many houses if you are ready to go out a bit and they offer so much more peace of mind and freedom.

20
No angle there sorry (hehe)