Basically, I was very close to being offered a position as a nanny today when they brought up the concern that they need somebody to work 50 hours/week, and had heard the contract cannot exceed 30 hours/week. I am aware that this is the limitation imposed on Au Pairs, however is there any kind of rule like this regarding nannies?
Thanks in advance for any information, because my internet-searching attempts have failed!
Those interested in a domestic position with a Swiss family should know the rules laid down by each Swiss canton. You must be a female between the ages of 17 (18 in Geneva) and 29 from Western Europe, North America, Australia, or New Zealand, stay for a minimum of one year and a maximum of 18 months, and attend a minimum of three hours a week of language classes in Zürich, four in Geneva. Families in most places are required to pay half the language school fees of 500-1,000 Swiss francs for six months. Au pairs in Switzerland work for a maximum of 30 hours per week, plus babysitting once or twice a week. The monthly salary varies among cantons but the normal range is 590-740 Swiss francs after all compulsory deductions for tax and health insurance have been made.
Am I wrong thinking that the max. hours worked would be different?
I will copy and paste below the differences. But, unfortunately, I don't know if there are different "labour laws" for these two different positions. Common sense tells me there would be. Perhaps you can google a government website describing the au pair program and you can go from there.
The main purpose of the Au Pair concept is to help college-aged students gain second language skills by giving them an opportunity to live long-term with a European family. Thus, they get a chance to be "immersed" in the language they are learning. It's not really meant to be a "profit-making" full-time job as you would hope for in any other type of work. Thus, you get a chance to experience "full-immersion" (free room and board) in return for babysitting and light housekeeping and some pocket money to tide you over until you leave.
Families mistakenly (I feel), look to au pairs as a nanny alternative but cheaper. This puts au pairs in a difficult position where more is asked of them than what they expect to give. Families may expect professional housekeeping/cooking/babysitting skills and the maturity of someone much older; but end up with a college-student inexperienced in all of the above!
Au pairs need to come into this with their eyes "wide-open" and realize they will not make a whole lot of money since this is not the point of the "au pair" program. There's a good chance there will be miscommunication and misunderstandings due the language-barrier and different expectations regarding child discipline, housekeeping etc. etc. There are problems in this realm even without the added second-language factor.
When I was in university, my friend (from Canada) took on an au pair job in Paris (to study French). She told me there were a lot of problems and she didn't have a smashing time. She was only in her early twenties. When I was that age, I didn't have a clue about housekeeping or childcare. I personally would hesitate hiring someone so young and inexperienced to look after my children in a full-time/live-in situation, imho. Occasional evening help I would be willing but the au pair program is only full-time/live-in.
My advice is that if you're looking for an au pair, your intent should include helping out a young student with their second language learning and not just finding cheap babysitting.
If you're looking for a nanny, then hire a nanny.
Hope this information helps someone.
PS. I have had experience with 3 live-in maids/nannies and several more that lived-out. This was in Asia. It's a huge learning curve having live-in help. People who have never experienced it have NO IDEA! Thus, I would not consider full-time nanny help (live-in or live-out) unless the lady had extensive previous experience and even better--has had experience raising her own children. There's a world of difference between someone who has raised her own children and one that doesn't have children. This is not to say that woman who haven't had children can't do a good job. But, there is a world of difference still. I know some families that will only accept someone "married" as well (a possibility in Asia, but not in Europe). I see their point too but won't elaborate here as this thread is about Europe.
http://switzerland.isyours.com/E/imm...y/au_pair.html
It says the Au Pairs should expect 30-40 hours of work. You have to take into consideration that part of their week, au pairs are expected to be studying their Second Language.
On the bottom of the webpage are several links to Au Pair agencies for Switzerland. Even though you don't want to be an au pair, I bet they could tell you if the labour laws governing regular nannies is the same or different. Good luck!
"Nannies do not necessarily have limitations in terms of duties, hours , commitment period, schooling, etc. as aupairs do."
The more I think about it, the more this makes sense.
http://www.cagi.ch/en/vie-pratique/t...du-travail.php La durée du temps de travail : dépend du secteur d'activité (maximum 45 heures ou 50h par semaine; au-delà de cette durée maximal, on parle de travail supplémentaire)
Under those rules 42.5 hours/week is the normal working hours and everything above 45 hours are considered overtime and grants you either equal time of or 25% more in salary. For the hours over 45 in a week that is.
You would have 4 weeks holiday and have the normal social security deductions etc.
I could tell you exactly what your rights are in Geneva and parts of Vaud (apparently the Nyon court applies Geneva rules mutatis mutandis), sorry can not help you about Zurich because I do not speak German.
Here is the link where you should be able to find relevant information:
Maybe you could call child care services Zürich and ask them if they could help answer your question
Now I have another question... they told me I am entitled to 20 days holiday, not 28. Is the 4 weeks law standard all across Switzerland or does it vary by canton?
I got this email from the employer:
We pay our current nanny Sfr 2,500 per month. In addition to your salary you/us will be charged as follows (for each of us) –
- AHV (State pension “social security”) - 5.05%
- Disability (IV) and unemployment insurance (ALV) - 1.00%
She is entitled to 20 days paid holidays per calendar year (1.67 per month)
She is covered for loss of salary in case of illness (subject to doctor certificate)
What are your salary expectations?
Well, 2,500/month seems quite low to me (that works out to less than $12/hour, which seems inadequate for Switzerland). From everything I've read on this forum and online, nannies get paid an average of 3,500-4,500... 3,000/month is the minimum (without taking into account that I will be working 50-hour weeks). But perhaps I should be taking this question into a different thread regarding nanny salaries... ( EDIT : found the answer in this thread)
This is confusing to me:
"Overtime over and above the agreed working hours but not exceeding the statutory maximum working time must in general be remunerated at time plus 25% or, if the employee agrees, be offset by a corresponding period of leave. However, different arrangements may be agreed in writing between employers and employees. Overtime in excess of the maximum weekly working time of 45 or 50 hours is governed by the provisions of the Labour Law. It must be remunerated at time plus 25% or, if the employee agrees, be offset by a corresponding period of leave."
(from here )
Overtime (hours over 45 resp. 50 hours) must have a specific reason, may not be more than 170/140 hours per year and may not be contractually renounced.
You may contractually agree to renounce over-hour payment up to 50 hours/week.
Regarding your salary; will you be getting room and/or board? That should also be taken into consideration when you compare salaries. Also how heavy will the workload be? Part of the day you may have a very light workload if the kids are at school or sleeping.
The potential employer is stating the social security deductions correctly.
I will be living outside of their home. As for workload, she has asked me if I am ok with doing some cleaning, ironing, and laundry, which is totally fine with me. I will be caring for an 11-month old for most of the day (so probably pretty light workload because it is a baby) and then a 5-year old for the last 2 hours of the day. These things considered, do you believe that 2,500 is a reasonable salary for a 50-hour week? That works out to about 11.36 CHF/hr...
Is it gross salary? (The salaries you are comparing are gross salaries)