Setting up a business selling stuff on Ricardo

Finance, Taxes, Banking, Insurance and Retirement
1
Anyone have any experience selling large amounts of merchandise on Ricardo?

How much can I sell before it is officially a business, and not just some guy selling a few items?

Should I set up a Ricardo Shop, or just operate as an individual?

Best way to accept payments? Best way to handle shipping?

The idea is to buy bulk from China (electronics - authentic brand names).

The prices are ca. 70% lower compared to retail stores here (CIF).

As far as I know, there are no duties on electronics, only VAT.

Thanks for your help, and yes, I did search this forum first and read through the threads.

2
I think it would be wise to sell a few items and see how it goes before you take the time and trouble to set up a business. Then if you want to set something up, take a look at the threads here on EF about what is required to set up a business, collecting VAT, reporting taxes, etc.

I think normally you need turnover of 120K per year before you have to do loads of paperwork, but if you're going to be importing truckloads of stuff then the rules might be different. Certainly the Post will sit up and take notice if you're getting regular packages from China.

I have to say, you can buy a lot of cheap stuff from China that is supposedly authentic but actually is not. So be careful with your suppliers. Also just because they say something is worth 5 Francs on their paperwork, that doesn't mean the Post will agree. Be prepared for a surprise here and there with imports.

Good luck, it seems to work for some folks!

3
Thanks for the advice 3Wishes. The plan is to start selling on Ricardo and see how it goes. If it takes off, then I will form a company, so everything is above board and no problems with the authorities.

The Chinese supplier assures me that the equipment is authentic and if I am not happy with the shipment, then it can be returned. I pay 30% up front, and rest on delivery. I have this equipment in my home and use it every day, so will be able to tell if it is not authentic. One issue I see is that the instructions are in English, and I will need to provide CH power cords.

The batch is ca. 100 pieces and costs ca. USD 10.000.- delivered by UPS to Switzerland. Adding 8% VAT and 6.5% Ricardo commission, I stand to make a profit of USD 8.000.- and that is if I sell it 20% cheaper than everyone else. Sounds too good to be true - and that worries me a bit.

We will see. Worst case scenario is I have Christmas gifts for family and friends for the next 10 years

4
I have a friend that does that. He offers over 8000 products all imported from China. He does about 200 CHF a year in sales.

Best of luck to you.

5
CHF 200.- in sales a year! That indicates my plan is not a viable business plan. Perhaps I need to use social media to promote sales? Set up a local web store using squarespace or some other platform? Utilize Google adwords to drive business to my site? Open up a bricks and mortar store on Bahnhofstrasse, sell at premium prices and forget about Ricardo all together?

6
Just a couple thoughts:

How are you going to provide Swiss power cords? Are there any regulations about messing with that? Are these certified for Switzerland/EU?

If you get caught bringing in fakes you will be in big trouble.

If these goods are not fakes, are you going through the company who's label the products have?

You are right. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.

7
My friend that sells Chinese goods, has Swiss power cords. The thing is is they are all basically the same cord, but with different endings. Problem is, it does work, but makes a loud humming/buzz noise.

I try to buy things from him to help support his effort, but all the things end up working with side effects, or not long enough. I mean go to Hornbach, and they are selling tons of tools made in China, that are basically disposable.

8
I didn't say all that. Just do more research then the entrepreneur section of the EF.

9
Thanks for the thoughts miniMia.

I will buy the Swiss power cords in bulk from China I am sure the ones they sell here in Bau und Hobby are made in Gong Chou province. EU certified and not a fire hazard Today everything is made in China, that is a reality.

The biggest risk is I get fake merchandise and customs confiscate the lot and I end up in jail for forgery.

I have contacted the company that owns the label and said "I would very much like to buy your product from you, but these Chinese guys are offering me a much lower price. Why is that"? They did reply, but the reply did not make any sense to the economist in me.

10
But are you going to change the power cord? Or are they ones that are not attached to the device? Is it like on a phone vs on a hair dryer (IYKWIM)?

I'd be very careful with this an look more into if they have the right to sell directly. It could be the company ordered 100k (or million, LOL) but they made 110K and are now selling these on the side. Is that considered "fake"/"counterfeit"? Switzerland is not the country to mess around with fakes.

11
Does the "The prices are ca. 70% lower compared to retail stores here (CIF)." include the delivery charge, including packaging?

do you have any experience as an individual both buying and selling on sites like ricardo & ebay?

If you have not, then I would suggest you start with something small and see how you get on, and the extra costs and hazzles you might not have expected.

have you checked if others are selling something similar to you on-line and what they are charging?

There are a lot of electric items in the shops that do get seasonally reduced, but most important reason we would buy from shop is the lengthy guarantee. The shops in switzerland have an excellent reputation for taking back goods at fault in the guarantee period

12
I have a friend who used to do so as well. He decided to always take the weekend shifts in his factory to pay the bills (because they paid 1.5 times...) and spend his weekdays setting up a retail business with electronic toys from China - both with an own webshop but mostly ricardo. He found a niche that worked, made a lot of experience what worked and what did not and by now quit the factory job and opened three "traditional" brick and mortar shops next to his online portal.

I think the key is to take it slow. You will make mistakes and have a learning curve - so it is important that you don't bet all your money on one product but hedge your risk buy having enough horses in the race.

13
I once thought of something similar, but I found most if not all products I found on electronics markets in China were already being sold by multiple vendors on Ricardo.

There are also perfect copies on the Chinese markets, they are even from the same factory, I've recently seen a Galaxy SIII of a guy who told me it's fake. I thought it was a joke at first as it looked exactly like mine, and then he showed me the missing ID underneath the battery and a tiny detail in one of the plastic parts. He thought it's original until he brought it a Samsung store for repairs.

14
You don't say what specific products you want to sell, but you do mention a power cord issue. Does this mean you'll need to open a factory-sealed product and swap cables, or will you keep the package sealed and include a Swiss cable on the side? Any reason why you could not simply order the product with a Swiss cable already included?

15
Here goes...

The plan is to import Sonos equipment from China and sell on Ricardo. Sonos is the market leader in Wireless HiFi System ́s. It allows for the streaming of internet sourced audio, and files stored on the local network. Wireless HiFi is very hot at the moment.

I found a few companies in China offering this equipment at very low prices. As an example, the Play:1 retails for CHF 240.00 in Switzerland, but buying bulk from China, the unit price is only USD 79.00. My retail price in Switzerland would be as low as CHF 180.00 The seller assures me it is authentic Sonos equipment.

The order I am negotiating is for ca. 100 units, mostly Play:1, but also a few Play:3 and Play:5. Total cost, including shipping, handling and insurance is ca. USD 10.000.00 I pay 20% up front, and rest on delivery.

The power cord needs to be replaced, but I already found a company in China that sells Swiss standard cords at USD 0.50 a pop, but minimum order is 500 units. I can easily replace the cords, as the boxes are not shrink wrapped, and I can just switch one for the other. The instructions that come with the equipment is in English.

I have no experience selling stuff on Ricardo, importing from China, or the retail market in general. I am a software developer, but do have experience in sourcing and contract negotiation.

I have followed Ricardo these last weeks, and there seems to be only one person selling new Sonos equipment. His selection is limited and mostly the high end stuff, like the Playbar that retails at CHF 750.00 Similar story with eBay uk and de. I also checked the on-line stores, and all seem to have pretty much the same (high) price.

That is pretty much my plan. If you think it is viable then please don ́t steal it More importantly, if you think it is flawed then I really want to hear your opinion. USD 10.000.00 is not a lot of money, only a month's salary for the typical EF member, but still, it is a nice luxury vacation in the Bahamas, or a new Smart car for the wife.

Below are "back of the napkin" calculations I did.

[](http://s1346.photobucket.com/user/villihelgason/media/Calculations_zps0552b0a4.png.html)

Note: The 10% customs is a safety net. As far as I can tell, there is no duty on electronic equipment in Switzerland.

16
If you are buying in bulk, and taking a risk of any size, is it in your budget to make part leisure, part travel trip to the factory in China to see first hand what they are doing there?

I have seen several documentaries in France, about factories that are making the both under the same roof. I mean, it might be worth it considering the legalities on the line.

17
Are you going to change these cords yourself? I would certain check if that is allowed. I don't know if it is or isn't. But definitely check. If you need a certified electrician to do this it will ad to your costs.

18
A few other things to consider as you plan...where will you store the inventory and insure it? Are you allowed to run a business from your current home/apartment? What will you do with all the cords you don't need? Will you offer instructions in German, French, Italian upon request? Have you seen the instructions in English? Sometimes the translations are horrible.

19
Interesting to read your business idea!

I would be scared to receive fakes however. They might look good and even function (partially) but you might get in trouble with that. Make sure you've got yourself covered

20
One problem no one mentioned is that if Sonos has outsourced production to a specific plant in China, it does not mean the plant is allowed to manufacture Sonos equipement and sell it to third party.

Also, what does "original" mean anyway? It could be "original" as created in the same plant but not approved by Sonos therefore not under warranty.

"Original" tends to have blurry definition in China.

Lastly, I would at least go check out the factory yourself to make it offers somewhat decent work conditions.

K