Stripped Naked by the Zürich Police

Daily Life, Swiss News and General Topics
1
An "English IT Specialist" was arrested for not having a tram ticket and forced to strip naked:

http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/dyn/news...ch/778543.html

Zwei Fälle hatten im letzten November für Schlagzeilen gesorgt. Ein 64-jähriger unbescholtener Mann fuhr in der Bahnhofstrasse mit dem Velo durch eine Einbahnstrasse. Er wurde von Stadtpolizisten angehalten, es kam zu einer Diskussion, der Mann zerriss schliesslich wütend den Bussenzettel über 30 Franken. Darauf wurde er verhaftet, gefesselt und auf die Hauptwache gebracht, wo er sich nackt ausziehen musste - inklusive Ehering.

Verhafteter will Plakate sponsern

Beim zweiten Fall wurde ein britischer IT-Spezialist und Angestellter einer Bank im Tram ohne Ticket erwischt. Er hatte kein Geld bei sich und konnte sich nicht ausweisen. Auch er musste sich auf dem Posten nackt ausziehen. In beiden Fällen betont die Stadtpolizei, die Verhafteten hätten sich renitent und unflätig verhalten; die beiden Männer behaupten das Gegenteil.

Go on, own up. Who are you?

And don't you know it's a crime to travel without a ticket

It's even more of a crime to have NO money at all on you!

I've never had any trouble with the Police (touch wood) but they are a well crafty lot here:

A little tale: I emerged from the Nelson Pub Central Zurich a few seasons ago having watched Man United play Arsenal in Football (sorry, soccer for my American friends ).

Outside was quite a sight:

Every single black person - and only black people - leaving the pub was being lined up against a wall and asked for papers.

It was a crafty move, because there's a lot of African fans of Arsenal who TBH go in the Nelson, share a Coke, watch the football and leave. Yeah and of course, some might be "illegals"...

2
For those who do not understand German, the first case refers to a man who rode his bike the wrong way down a one way street. He was given a ticket by the police, he then started to argue with them and then tore up the ticket which was not, perhaps, the wisest of moves ! They duly obliged him by putting on handcuffs and taking him of to the station to be searched.

The second case was an British IT worker who was riding a tram without a ticket (illegal), money (illegal) or any ID (illegal). He was taken to the police station and searched.

3
It's illegal to have no money on you?

ID, ticket, fair enough... but does bank card or credit card count as "money"?

4
That's a good question ! I don't know. I only know that when I moved here 18 years ago I checked on the regulations and discovered that you should alway have at least CHF 5 on you. Don't think it's something the police would normally enforce but if they catch you without a ticket and no ID........

5
I have to say I have never heard of a rule about not having money is a crime. Also I though all the rules said was that if asked for id you have to be able to get hold of it in good time. I certainly don't always carry my passport or ausweiss. Though my id from the company has my picture as does my GA so I assume they also count as id.

I think the police are over stepping the mark, it reminds me of the idiocy when they stopped the FCB fans at Altstetten. An incredible over reaction.

Have fun

Martin

6
I think the rule about having money on you is very old and something to do with begging on the streets. I learned this from my Swiss relations. Regarding ID I've always understood that you must have it at all times although I don't know what the Police would, or would not, accept.

7
I'm not sure if they ever repealed it in England, where if you didn't have enough money for three day's worth of food, then the laor of the manor could have you work for him for some unspecified time as you were technically a vagrant. All a fair while ago, mind...

8
When I lived in Belgium it was also a law you had to have at least BEF500 and ID (that's what? EUR10?)

9
What are the stop-and-search laws in Switzerland? Does 'probable cause' exist here? Does this mean that I need to carry money with me when I'm out running? Sitting on my balcony? Getting my mail?

If it was CHF 5 a few years ago, is it CHF 10 or 20 now? This sure sounds like a Swiss urban legend.

10
Isn't the judicial system here based around Napoleonic Code? ie the Police can stop you any time they want?

Regarding the Nelson... slightly off topic, but... I was upstairs in Lady Hamiltons a couple of years ago on a "crawl". One of my friends didn't seem to have made it inside, so I went looking for them. I went down the stairs, and found that the bouncers weren't letting any of the Indian guys in our group through the door. There was no particular reason - they weren't drunk or anything. So we went to the News bar instead.

11
I was surprised to learn of this recently as well - you must carry ID with you at all times, which can be darned inconvenient sometimes. The police have the right to ask you to produce it - even without good reason. You don't have to produce it, but then of course they have the right to detain you until they've ascertained who you are if they feel like it....

12
In 19 years here I have never been stopped by the police, either on foot or in the car. But I am ever hopeful I will still be stripped one day...

13
When you say you checked on the regulations, where would one go to check on things like this?

Does it mean browsing through books and books of all the laws, or is there some sort of "daily life" summary published?

Being new here, I don't want to just assume the laws are the same as in the US, and then by accidentally brake them (or needlessly follow ones that don't exist here).

Thanks,

Scott

14
Regarding the Nelson... slightly off topic, but... I was upstairs in Lady Hamiltons a couple of years ago on a "crawl". One of my friends didn't seem to have made it inside, so I went looking for them. I went down the stairs, and found that the bouncers weren't letting any of the Indian guys in our group through the door. There was no particular reason - they weren't drunk or anything. So we went to the News bar instead.[/quote]

Glad you posted this... i mentioned the Nelson in an "are the swiss racist thread" and got a fair amount of flak from people who did not believe this happens.

The Nelson does indeed operate on a colour bar policy. I had the experience once and have never been there again. So have a lot of people i know here, including mixed race couples (one had his brazilian wife thrown out while he was in the loo cos the security accused her of being a prostitute). The interesting thing though, if you beg long enough they actually will relent and let you in ....not my style tho

Utterly shameful..... but off topic so we say no more

15
In three years here ... I've probably been stopped 19 times ....lol

16
The rule about money is very old and is more or less universal. In England such a law also exists that you must have sufficient money with you to contact a relative. If you are carrying a mobile phone with sufficient credit then I guess that must also do but I do not know of this being ever tested primarily because the police would never pull you in for having no money - although they could. Also in most countries as the law has not been changed for ages then the money amount is ridiculous... As to the ID, quite correct you must be able to prove who you are at any time when asked. Things that are adequate for this purpose are passports, aliens permit, country issued ID card and driving license, also foreign or international driving license. Nothing else, no GA unless you are on public transport, no credit cards and no work badges so be warned...

17
When I was preparing to move here 20 years ago I had a book called, I think, Living and Working In Switzerland which was packed with loads of info.

The main thing is to always have ID on you. In the case that started this thread a Brit rode a tram without a ticket, no money and no ID which just about guarantees ending up at the police station !

Regarding having money on you, as Richard says, it's a old law and one that probably applied in most countries in the past.

18
Thanks for this information. I too have this book. I wasn't sure if there was a more official publication from the Swiss gov't outlining laws applying to daily life. In the mean time, I'll have a closer look at Living and Working in Switzerland.

-Scott

19
Regarding the minimum money law, I'd heard it's been used in kindness, with police rounding up the vagrants on cold nights and sticking them in cells so they don't freeze to death.

No idea where I heard it, may also be an urban myth.

20
now in Amsterdam , I would agree ....