I know back in my day some exam boards were considered better than others so not all A levels were necessarily considered to be equal.
I know a lot of things have change in the UK recently so it is probably all different now but do they still have different exam boards?
Yes different boards and yes that was the case, more so at GCSE level (WJEC for example) but since the recent overhaul I'd say that there's not much difference now. Well, the diference for all of them is linear courses, terminal exams and a huge amount of content. Huge. Anyone who believes UK qualifications are dumbing down should try sitting one of the GCSE English language papers. Not fun.
No there is no parity. The graph in the link shows Matura rates per canton, and there are significant differences, unless we assume that kids in Geneva and Ticino are just brighter than in St. Gallen!
How is that kind of system deemed acceptable, particularly as everything else official in CH (apart from rubbish collection ) is quite rigid?
It's not really acceptable but I think that's the way it is.
Maybe someone who has experience or teaches in a gymnasium can let us know if the following is true: For the Matura, is it then true that your teacher is also the examiner and they also set the papers based on what they (want to?) teach?
If that's true it would then follow that the relationship between the teacher and student would be very important. It would also make the student less vocal in voicing any concerns about anything at all; they would just need to get on with what needs to be done to pass.
I'm sure they do have a curriculum to follow as do I at a vocational school. However theres always a degree of freedom with additional content. The exam relevant stuff however is fixed.
I can imagine that the gymi teachers work together with other schools on their exam.
Some would say thats the only important thing in teaching. I'm not speaking about being best friends with your students, but without mutual respect and "a general sense off wellbeing" real learning is just not possible.
It is indeed the subject teacher who sets the exam and who does the marking as well! In theory, this does not necessarily mean that the teacher can teach want he or she wants as the school curriculum supposedly tells the teacher what to teach. In reality, there can be significant differences not just between cantons but also between schools (in bigger cantons with several Gymnasiums). With this in mind, the EDK (federal education commission) adopted some recommendations for gymnasiums across Switzerland in order to harmonise exam requirements. These are really recommendations only and for many gymnasiums who fiercely defend their autonomy, even these recommendations go to far...
Absolutely but setting your own exam...
Wowsers. I'm genuinely amazed this is permitted. Lots of grey areas. Thank you fpr explaining.
That's why you have a pretty good system of an objectivity support and get outside profs to sit in your exams, they have to be quality teachers in the same level of schools or higher. They go over the teacher's grading and corrections and supervise the oral exams, do half the oral assessment. Works quite well.
Btw, one cannot compare well the Matu and the IB unless kids are 100% bilingual and have similar career paths. The Matu exams I supervize are really tough...but prepare well for tough local unies.
If a kid doesn't have it in them, better to know at 15 than 18. Adjust the strategy. The inflexibility some talk about here is a myth, really, many adaptable ways to reach similar outcome and degrees - slower, faster, more academic, less academic, cheaper or more expensive, cantonal or intercantonal, depending on parents or not, languages, etc. I like it, because of the autonomy it gives to the kids.
It is a significant decision, and may have to do with the type of learner the student is, and what career he/she plans to pursue. If you want to go to EPFL or other Swiss unis, take the Matu. If you want to study in England or North America, the IB may be a better choice. IB is more themed study and public/community service oriented; Matu has more subjects and is a more academically difficult degree (says students who switched from matu to IB); both can be bilingual...Matu at the federal level (more difficult than cantonal) can be biligual or not, if you take the bilingual option you will have two Swiss languages plus English, otherwise you still need two Swiss languages, you cantonal language and an additional. If you are taking Matu for the federal exam, you will have exams in August and spend some time over the summer studying. Good luck!
Having taught for twelve years at a gymi, I agree that many gymistudents are probably more suited to an apprenticeship, but it is not so simple:
The apprenticeships are generally not given on the basis of open competition (some big companies may do this) -parental connections at the local level can be the determining factor. This does not motivate bright unconnected kids -they will not get the apprenticeship they wanted and it is difficult for them to see that the apprenticeship is just a stepping stone. The path to university is tough after an apprenticeship. The Berufsmatura, which is more vocational, is generally done in part-time study and only gives direct entry into a Fachhochschule - another year- the Passarell, is required for the ETH. The good side of the Berufsmatura is that companies often prefer these candidates . the big problem for expats is that the apprenticeship does not give them an internationally recognised school leaving qualification
To return to the thread:
Son did the Matura
Daughter did IB
Both doing fine (I hope )
Matura is anyway better for the Swiss Universities. For IB you need to be very careful regarding the selection of subjects. For my daughter graduating with IB in Jordan we relied to the School on the choice of subjects. The Swiss Universities then said 'we do not count this and that' and 'this and that is missing'. Consequently make sure when the subjects are selected that they will be sufficient for the Swiss Universities. Check with them in time and do not rely on what your school says. All these uncertainties will not occur if you can choose the Matura.
Just to throw another little something onto the fire, have we forgotten about the French Bac? Undergoing revision and is also used as an entry to Swiss universities.
It had some issues not so long ago, but they appear to be on their way to being sorted.
p.s. reminder to self: read the thread title...
My personal belief is that success depends on the age at which further studies are determined. That age still varies from canton to canton. In Neuchâtel and Vaud the decisive exams (which allow the child to go to the "gymnasium") take place in 5th and 6th grade, while in Geneva the final decision is in 8th and 9th grade (unless things have changed, please correct me if I am wrong). I feel if the child is older when that selection is made, they've got a better chance of pursuing a high education.
Another point I believe, is that because Swiss universities are of the highest standards and they are practically free, the demand exceeds the offer, and as a result the bar is set very high based on intellect.
I've known an ex student who went on to do Berufsmatura and then she was accepted into a UK University on a Bachelors degree. She has just obtained her Masters in accounting from a UK University. So I think many UK Universities would be open to Berufsmatura.
I also have a colleague whose daughter obtained a very good Swiss Matura and was not accepted by Durham University as they did not recognise it. Not saying this is a general rule, it could be an isolated case, but for sure it happened. This year.
Similarly, I have know students with the IB who applied to study Chemistry at Oxbridge and were informed that they needed to 'top up' with a Chemistry A level as apparently the science content was not in depth enough in that particular IB.
Again, all people I have known with different experiences.
Something else must have happened, not related to the Swiss Matura.
Durham University does recognize the Swiss Matura.
https://www.dur.ac.uk/international/...y.information/
Perhaps she didn't pass the IELTS?
It might have been course specific.
Complete nonsense.
You can't fill the 81'000 apprenticeships that were available last year by "connections". Even more so when more 11-12'000 could not be filled at all.
But that aside! Look at the marks in the Matura compared to English A levels? I've cut and pasted it below but the formatting is out. It is an unrealistic expectation for most children doing the Matura. It's my impression that there is a low understanding in overseas universities of how difficult the Matura is.
A*A*A Federal Maturity Certificate / Certificat de Maturite / Baccalaureat / Cantonal Maturity Certificate with an overall score of 5.5 and 6 in specific subjects.
A*AA Federal Maturity Certificate / Certificat de Maturite / Baccalaureat / Cantonal Maturity Certificate with an overall score of 5.5 and 5 in specific subjects.
AAA Federal Maturity Certificate / Certificat de Maturite / Baccalaureat / Cantonal Maturity Certificate with an overall score of 5.5 and 5 in specific subjects.
AAB Federal Maturity Certificate / Certificat de Maturite / Baccalaureat / Cantonal Maturity Certificate with an overall score of 5 and 5 in specific subjects.
ABB Federal Maturity Certificate / Certificat de Maturite / Baccalaureat / Cantonal Maturity Certificate with an overall score of 5 and 5 in specific subjects.