Working full time and owning a Cocker Spaniel

Family, Education, Health and Pets
1
Hi,

So my husband and I are contemplating on getting a Cocker Spaniel but I read in a few articles that this breed has worse separation anxiety than others and struggle to be alone even during a short time. We both leave the house at 8 and will not get back till 6:30. We will walk her 30-45 mins before and 30-45 mins after work, and will have a dog walker come around 12 or 1 to give her 1 hour walk and playtime.

Any Cocker Spaniel owners out there can please let me know if they had experience with this breed and how they dealt with being alone like this? Is 2 hour walk sufficient for an adult Cocker Spaniel? What else can we do to give her a happy, healthy and balanced life? Also we live in a (quite spacious) apartment.

Thank you

2
As Meloncollie, our resident expert in all things canine, has perhaps forgotten to carry out her 'every-five-minutes-check out EF Pet Corner' duty on her mobile phone while out with her dogs, I'm linking a thread with info from her in it.

Looking to get my first dog/puppy. Help please

This, and the links given there, will keep you going till she is on here again.

3
My mother use to breed Welsh Springers, they need a lot of attention and exercise. when left alone they messed up the house badly. Carpet, doors and furniture. Seriously, it's like having children.

Do not get dogs unless you are willing to give up your job, it's cruel and unfair on the animal.

4
Just to add, a dog rescue center would not even consider you if you are contemplating leaving any dog that amount of time everyday at home alone.

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This one on a cocker spaniel. Dogging! Well, puppying!

6
Are you considering a puppy or adopting an adult?

If a puppy, it would be unconscionably irresponsible to bring a puppy into a home where the pup is left alone most of the day. A puppy needs full time interaction, socialization, training, metal stimulation for the first many months, or individual dependent, years.

Some people manage it with full time day care - but then a very real worry is that the pup often does not bond with you, rather it bonds with the sitter. (I see this in our Hundeschule now. The dog is amazing with the sitter but a nightmare with the owners who now and again show up on weekends.) In such a case you have an adult dog who really isn't fully 'yours' - and you have to start from scratch re-training, re-socializing, re-bonding.

If you are thinking of the full time day care route, also be aware of the expense. Sending a very young pup to a multi-dog day care facility is really not recommended as the pup would not get the attention it needs, (and often impossible because the dog is still entire) so you would be looking at hiring someone as your full time employee for the first X months.

A puppy is a 24/7 commitment. If you are not available 24/7, a puppy is not for you. Perhaps consider adopting an older dog.

I do know whereof I speak. I've told this story before, but it bears repeating:

I was a career-driven workalcoholic, working round the clock, traveling constantly on business. I did not have the time left over to properly care for a potted plant, let alone any sort of sentient being.

Out of the blue, my MIL arrived on my doorstep with a surprise. A puppy. Whisky Tango Foxtrot? What in the name of all that is holy was I, the never-at-home-workaholic, going to do with a puppy?

On the other hand, what would the fates have in store for that poor puppy if I gave her back to a woman clueless enough to buy a puppy as a surprise gift for someone whose life was wholly inappropriate to puppy-rearing? Worse, what if MIL gave the puppy back to the (insert expletive here) breeder who was unethical enough to sell the puppy knowing it would be a surprise gift to an unknown third party?

Poor poor puppy. After such a questionable start and with a questionable future looming I couldn't let her end up in the wrong hands.

So... I called in every favor I could, spent every extra penny finding a solution. My sainted retired father came to stay at my house most days, I hired a puppy sitter for the times he could not help, OH and I staggered our working days so one of us could be home whenever possible. And of course every single free moment was dedicated to the puppy. No dinners out, no non-puppy entertainment.

But that wasn't enough. It quickly became clear that I had to drop out of the corporate race if I was to do right by my puppy.

Even though I had the day covered so that my pup was never alone, that wasn't the same as being with me, socializing to my life, my ideas of training. And it showed.

I was lucky in that St Swimbo was one of those rather rare critters, an easy pup despite her poor start. But it could have gone so very, very wrong. Well, actually some things did go wrong, and I paid the price for the next 15 years.

Sooooo... please, think carefully. Do not get a puppy unless you are in a position to give it the time, attention, socialization, and training necessary. I'll say it again - a young pup needs someone right there, on the spot, 24/7.

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If you would consider an older dog, one whose character is known and who is has proven to be OK with being alone for some hours, that might be a possibility. But again, you will still need some form of dog care. An adult dog will still need mental stimulation througout the day, and certainly must have a chance to empty his bladder regularly. Here you might consider doggy day care, or a sitter who comes for several hours. The right individual must be carefully selected to fit into your situation.

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However - a dog with separation anxiety must not be left alone as you anticipate. Separation anxiety can be worked on, but it is not an easy or quick road to a solution. The question I have for you:

What if you got your dog and then found out that he had separation anxiety? What if he destroyed your house, if the neighbors lodged complaints against you? What would you do then?

If the answer is 'give him back to the shelter/breeder' then in the strongest of terms dog ownership is not for you.

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Sooooo - to recap: Given the scenario you describe, no - you should not take on a puppy, of any breed. Rather if you think you could provide a good home for a dog within the framework of your current commitments and lifestyle, consider an older dog, a settled mature adult or senior, one whose past and character is known, who has undergone assessment and has been found to likely fit into the life you can provide. And you must commit to providing that life, to meeting the dog's needs, no matter what else is going on in your life, now and for the rest of the dog's natural lifetime.

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Towards that end, as you are mulling over your suitability to dog ownership, have you done the SKN Theory course? If you are a first time dog owner, get that done before you go any further. The course is designed to get you thinking of these issues upfront, before you make that 15+ year commitment.

Once you determine that you can indeed offer a dog all that he needs, for his entire lifetime no matter what the winds of fate may blow into yours - only then should you start thinking about breeds or mixes, only then should you start your search for the right individual.

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Dear, dear, dear meloncollie

I have referred people to your many good posts before. This last one is simply EXCELLENT. People often use the verb "have" or "get" for a puppy, while you, on the other hand, write about "puppy rearing".

Well done for being a constant campaigner for the realism of it all. I sometimes wish there were a complusory equivalent to the SKN Theory Course for people thinking about having children, i.e. "designed to get you thinking of these issues [the commitment, the priorisation] upfront".

@blackcat88

I commend you for doing exactly that thinking beforehand, and for searching for wise answers before leaping. Well done for that!

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Blackcat, peeking over your other threads, I see you had to give your cats away due to allergies.

Do be aware that you might face the same allergic reaction to dog fur or saliva. Anyone with known allergies must thoroughly investigate these issues well ahead of considering dog ownership, and must again - repeat must! - test for potential allergic reaction with the individual dog under consideration . Testing with a dog of a similar breed is not enough, no you have the potential to react to any individual, so you must test with the individual.

Allergies can sometimes only be known over time, as you found out with your cats only after you had taken them on. This is why an extensive trial period is needed - which is often ends up being a cruel situation for the dog, and for the family members, should it not work out.

From the fall out I have seen via my rescue work, I discourage most known allergy sufferers from getting a dog. All too often it goes pear-shaped, with the dog getting the short end of the stick. It is simply not fair to take on a dog knowing that there is a real chance that you will not be able to fulfill the commitment you make.

If you think you could overcome your allergy with medication, if your doctor agrees, and you are fully committed to that course for the dog's natural lifetime, you still must go through a trial. Additionally you must have back up plan in place for someone to offer the dog a good home should it all go wrong. The back-up person needs to also be vetted by the breeder/rescue - and this needs to be written into the sales/adoption contract. (Honestly, from my own experience, not many breeders/rescues would allow a placement in this situation.)

Please, if you have allergies, please think this through carefully, and then think again. Too many dogs lose their homes - and some their lives - because of allergies in the family.

Here is a good thread discussing issues around allergies and pet ownership:

Hypoallergenic dog breed

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Our little Rookie came to us because of an allergy problem in his original family. He has been with us for 8 years now. We are still in touch with his first family and meet up from time to time

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"English Springer Spaniels don't like to be left alone and may become nuisance barkers if they're bored or lonely"

"English Springer Spaniels were developed to have great stamina and energy. Be sure that you can provide your dog with adequate exercise or he may become nervous and destructive."

Read more at http://dogtime.com/dog-breeds/englis...UYA1tOuKBaZ.99

OP, please, please think again. Take all the great advice given already and don't at this time take in a puppy.

Just a quick search came up with so many reasons why this breed would not cope well in your current situation. Spaniels, all spaniels, are true working dogs, that is why they are valued as sniffer dogs, they just don't ever stop. Many end up in rescue due to owners being unable to deal with the level of commitment required to keep them happy.

Spaniels are also renowned for "growing up slowly", they are very trainable, but only if you have the time, every day, to train them. Forget quiet weekends, lye ins will be a thing of the past. Walking in all weathers, at least twice a day and not just 45 minutes each time. Having to take the dog on holiday with you or organising good holiday care.

So many things to consider, please think again and wait until your lifestyle allows you be all that you need to be.

11
Blackcat, assuming that your allergy issues can be managed:

For you, and for any full time worker considering dog ownership who might be reading this, as an alternative to getting a dog while your work schedule is so demanding, volunteering with an animal shelter might be something to consider.

Several shelters have volunteer dog walking programs where the public is invited to walk one of the shelter dogs. These programs are so very valuable to helping the dog with socialization, to helping the staff assess the dog - which in turn helps him find the right home.

Volunteer dog walking gives one the opportunity for some doggy company and fun exercise - but the commitment required might be more in line with what a full time worker can provide.

Some shelters have structured Gassigehen programs, some are a bit more loosely set up - call shelters local to you to see what is needed, what is asked for.

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Another thought - but again, assuming first that your allergy issue has been addressed:

Why not occasionally offer to help friends with their dogs on weekends when you are not working? Dogsitting is always needed. Again, you'd have the fun, you'd learn more about what a dog requires - but the commitment would be more in line with what you can provide.

(Note: If one provides dog care free of charge one does not need any special classes, but paid dog care requires the SKN classes, the same as a dog owner must have.)

You might also occasionally accompany dog owning friends when they take their dogs to training classes. This can be an eye-opener for future dog owners, a good chance to learn before taking the leap - and many training schools will encourage this.

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But not to sound like a broken record... The allergy issue must be assessed first.

I cannot stress strongly enough how very important it is to first deal with your allergies. Anything else would be grossly unfair to all concerned.

12
The more important question is what will you do if this does happen? Are you prepared to do whatever you have to in order to address the problem.

You can talk to 10 different people that have owned cockers with no problem but yours still might have separation anxiety or another problem. My Dad had one when I was growing up and we never had any problems with him (I wasn't there all the time though). But that doesn't mean that the dog you end up with will be the same.

We have raised two dogs as adults, one is still with us, one died earlier this year. Recently we have been thinking about adopting another dog so Noe has a partner in crime again but we are hesitant because of the commitment involved (emotionally maybe not ready yet either but that is a different story). There are tons of rewards to owning a dog and the cost-benefit analysis heavily leans towards the benefit side if you are ready to put in the work. Just make sure you are ready. The rest of our story is below if you are interested.

************************************************** ***********

When we first decided to add a dog to our family we thought we were prepared. We both grew up with dogs so we knew the amount of work we had to put in. We had a breed/size of dog that we thought would be suitable for us. We researched them, researched training, dog parks, vets, everything we could think of. In the end, all that seemed to matter was that we were committed to the dog and doing whatever we had to so her needs were met.

Why? Well, we got Noe, a boston terrier as a puppy and holy crap we had no idea what we were in for. All of the research, dog park visits and dog sitting could not prepare us for the little ball of fire we had just committed to raising. She had so much energy...she still does and she is 9.

In the end we had staggered schedules to allow her an hour of running in the morning and two hours at night, doggy day care all day, and all morning both Saturday and Sunday were spent on the sandy cliffs by the ocean in San Francisco. Even then, it was barely enough. On top of that the dog is crazy. She jumped off rocks into the ocean which she wasn't strong enough to swim in, jumped onto the kitchen counter from the ground to get her toys, climbed over whatever barrier we had constructed, really just did anything she thought could.

Fortunately, she wasn't destructive. She just jumped on everything and moved constantly. She did not care what it was, what she knocked over or who was in her way. Everyone we talked to just said that we got a dog with more energy than normal. Training was hard because we could only do enough with her to take the edge off so to speak and not completely calm her down or wear her out. Trainers were at a loss.

In the end we learned enough from them, combined with advice from the vet and internet that we were able to get her mostly trained. Living in Switzerland has been amazing because swimming and/or hiking 1-2 hours a day plus a walk with the dog walker does the trick now. It was all worth it but no amount of research could have prepared us.

When she was 1 we adopted Shelby, a pug, and realized that Shelby was more suited to our lifestyle. My in-laws got a pug shortly after and theirs is almost as crazy as our Boston so it really depends on the dog, not the breed. Sadly our pug died earlier this year from pug dog encephalitis. Incredibly rare. In the end, that is hardest part of having a dog...losing them.

13
This is my cocker!

He is an enormous amount of work, and since getting him neither myself nor my partner have both done a full day simultaneously in the office .

We have flexible working so alternate late starts/early finishes, combined with the dogsitter at lunchtimes (averaging 3 hours collection to return), to never leave him more than a couple of hours at a time.

When he is alone, we observe him via the webcam so know he's ok.

Also working 15 mins from home means we can dash home between meetings and carry on from home. We've had to be bare faced with prioritising the dog above the office commitment.

Also due to unexpected illness, we've had weeks working from home and a dozen or so afternoons off to take him to the vets in the next Kanton.

I do not see how the OP can make such a commitment looking at the proposed hours.

The commitment of dog ownership seems to be nearly as much as having a child, only without the luxury of the school time.

Bide your time OP, and when the chance comes, like changing jobs, going part time, relocation etc, then take it.

14
We have a cocker that's now 2yrs old. He's a very simple and hardy dog except for his tail splits and grass seed ailments, also he's a tick magnet receiving around 5-10 ticks p/day (the terriers only 1-2 p/wk). They are simple to train and extremely biddable, nothing really over faces ours (so far).

As to leaving him home alone ? I wouldn't leave our children like that so why a dog ?

3yrs ago we have took on a 12 month old Irish Terrier that someone left home alone for the first 9 months, it's taken +2yrs to get him to a reasonable level and there's still some work to be done.

If you need a dog for a day you can borrow ours, mud ticks and all, it will give you an Impression of what to expect from a cocker.....

15
A tad off topic, but as cocker fans are probably looking at this thread...

While perusing the Tierdatenbank earlier today, as you do*, this lovely lady caught my eye:

http://schaffhauser-tierschutz.ch/ein%20platz.htm

An 8 year old female cocker spaniel looking for a home, currently in Schaffhausen. Still quite active for her age, but also settled into maturity. What a beauty!

Blackbird, if you are still reading this thread - and it goes without saying assuming you have addressed the allergy issues - this is perhaps the kind of dog who might be better suited to your family at the present time .

And anyone who knows cockers knows that 8 is not by any stretch of the imagination an old dog. Lots of years of fun and adventure, love and companionship ahead.

Just sayin'.

* Why do I torture myself looking through the database? Odds are my permit would be revoked should I add a fourth to the Muttley Crew.

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And there I was thinking that kids were a handful. At least with kids, they have to go to school, giving me a bit of peace!

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What a beautiful, beautiful girl! Just look at that face, so full of love! I do hope she finds a family to take care of her.

Meloncolie, I know just how you feel! I saw the photo of Blutsi, 13 years old and looking for someone to love him. I just adore terriers, but I tell myself with two already it would be irresponsible.......it would, wouldn't it?...... to take a third, and probably would not be permitted by the SPA.

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We would love a pet, but our lifestyle at present does not allow us to adopt one full time. What we do is spending time with a neighbor's pet (with his full knowledge and consent), and also, our local chapters of the Humane Society and Animal Rescue League offer courses and volunteer opportunities that we participate in. Maybe one day we will be able to offer full-time, undivided attention to a pet, but until then, we try to get as educated as we can, while getting some "practice" in - kind of like a prenatal class

Would something like that (courses, volunteer, etc.) be an option where you live?

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We had 2 cockers for the last 12 years - one sadly passed away in February and we are left with one (profoundly deaf from birth) cocker. I only work 8 hours a week and with kids in the public school system I am home A LOT. I still think he's on his own for longer than he would like sometimes. Especially if we want to go out swimming or on a hot day in the summer where it's too hot for him to happily be out with us. The hours you are describing I think would be way too long for a dog of any age to be alone - what a sorry existence. My dear friends have a dog and work these types of hours and their cocker cross goes to doggy day care so he's with other dogs and people all day - I think that's the only way I could have a dog and not feel I wasnt being unfair to them. My remaining cocker has mild separation anxiety which definitely got worse when we lost his life pal. We have got a kitten since to keep him company when I am at work for a couple of hours or out running errands he cant come on. Honestly I cant imagine life without dogs but it's a massive commitment not just money to friday with a 9-5. We had 1 holiday abroad in 10 years as we took them with us when we went away. These are all things to think about as well. But honestly cocker or any breed, I dont think it's fair to leave them so long even with dog walking during the day.

I'd echo offering to have friends dogs when they go away for the weekend or skiing (another thing that we are restricted with) so you can have the joy of a pooch but not feel youre not giving them what they deserve over a full time period.

Ps - watch The Secret Life of Pets.

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Why would you need to be willing up on your job? Why can't you have both? Both my grandmother and my mother wanted to pursue their professional career and have kids at the same time. They just had to get someone to be there for the children while they were at work, and at the end of their working days they spent lots of quality time with the kids. And we are talking about kids here. Of course it is possible with dogs.