Yet another choosing a family car post

Transportation, Travel and Trips
1
Hi almighty EF car experts!

We are a family of 3 looking to buy a new family car. I read many threads here about the same subject but would like to have your views on what to buy for our specific case please.

Budget: <=20k

Family: 2 adults + baby in car seat so Isofix a must

Luggage space: we do NOT travel light

Looking for: a car to last us a very long time (we do not plan on leaving Switzerland) so a durable, efficient not too high maintenance car to die of old age. Maybe an eco-friendlier car as well if that exists at all?

Use: Mainly for weekend trips as we will go often to France near the border or to Germany and one big vacation per year farther away probably 2000km.

Extra costs: Road taxes, insurance, maintenance, anything else to consider? We do have 2 parking spaces.

We have looked a lot on autoscout and ricardo and saw the Mazda 5 and the Volvo V60 as good options, however we are still completely clueless.

Some questions:

- do you have any other car suggestions?

- what are the brands that have lower maintenance costs? I realise that each individual have different experiences but we would prefer not to go with French or Italian.

- would the Mercedes B 180 be an option or too small?

- any English speaking car dealers out there that we could go to?

- should we ask and pay a mechanic to go with us and check the car? Where can we find one?

- should we demand to do a test drive and is that acceptable here?

Silly question sorry:

- we have all our savings in Euros, how should we go about changing it to CHF to buy the car without giving too much money to the banks (maybe I'll post this on Finance if it's better)?

Thanks in advance. I can give more info if needed.

2
For me I would only buy Japanese. Honda, Mazda or Korean Kia, Hyundai. You cannot beat Honda for reliability despite what others will say. If you want a car till it dies then stay away from French.

Roadtax depends on the kanton you will live in as some calculate on weight of the car, some on engine size etc.

For insurance you have to reckon on 1000 - 1500chf for fully comp. Check comparis.ch for insurance prices and car market.

Newer German cars are well over estimated, I have plenty of friends who had many problems with Audi, BMW, VW etc.

I've been an aircraft technician for 30 years so I'm not a car expert but I know what is good or bad quality.

3
I would only buy German or Japanese. It takes car companies about 2 years to sort out all the problems with their new car models, so I would buy a new car which has been in production for at least 2 years.

If you can read German, the German car magazine produces a catalogue this time of year, showing full details of all the cars for sale in Germany, (including imported models) with a summary of their test reports.

I am very happy with the Skoda Fabia, we bought it new 2 years ago for about CHF 15'000 from a small garage near Lucerne.

4

Secondhand Nissan Qashqai might do well. We’ve had two, 1 petrol, 1 diesel model and have been very happy with both. Plenty of luggage space, comfortable, economic.

As far as dealing with the dealers, most will speak English I would think, certainly the sales people. I would think if you join TCS - the AA/RAC, etc, equivalent here - then you might be able to get someone to go along with you. And yes, asking for a test drive is perfectly normal.

Alternatively, maybe Mobility would do you for the weekends and then you’d just need to hire a car for the holidays.

https://www.mobility.ch/en/private-customers/

5
Some people really seem to swear by the Madzas.

Personally, I'm not (that much) interested in them and as such have no idea how well they work in practice.

Volvo - I'm either not sure how well the recent models work - after all, it's now owned by a Chinese car company ;-)

When in doubt, you can always have the car tested at one of TCS's "Technical centers":

https://www.tcs.ch/de/der-tcs/sektionen/#3

Mercedes B-class is maybe a bit too small.

Test-drive is a must, IMO (unless you're buying new, BTO, then you obviously can only drive a similar model).

As for your Euros: you can always buy in Germany and import. You will have to factor in 1.08*1.04 (=VAT+tax) times the price + some more for various other charges on import.

The selection is usually bigger (except there are less models with 4x4).

But there are enough dealers who import cars themselves these days - you will have to do the math on that one yourself, depending on the car(s) you want to buy.

I'm more a VW/Skoda/Seat guy (Audi is way overpriced, esp. new).

With your constraints, I found this:

http://www.autoscout24.ch/de/autos/s...kDetail3548789

(discarding models older than 2013)

If you include VW Passats, one more result shows up, but with CNG "fuel".

If you go one year further, two additional Passats show up.

Same search for Germany:

http://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/se...&usedCarSeals=

only those with some sort of "seal":

Most of those aren't near the border, though.

http://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/se...edCarSeals=Any

Not sure if it's worth doing a tour through Germany, visiting all those dealers in the North...

6
Thanks! As soon as we have 2 choices lined up we will use comparis for the insurance costs and compare everything. Right now we are just stuck on which car to buy but good to know that Mazda would be a good option.

Good point about the not too recent cars. Thanks!

Had never heard of mobility. I will check it however I don't know if in the long run it wouldn't be best to just buy our own car since we plan on staying.

Wow thank you for this!

We thought about Germany and we did the calculations with 2 of our potential options between changing EUR to CHF and buy the car here or buy in Germany and import it here. It almost breaks even and the hassle of importing makes me thing that we will just have to bay the bank fees.

That Skoda looks great. Is it easy in terms of maintenance, finding parts, etc around here?

7
Mobility is useless for anything but (very) casual use.

Way too expensive.

IMO.

And you have to return the car where you started, which further reduces its usefulness in my opinion.

8
I was checking their website and it is probably nice for someone coming to visit us here and we still don't have our own car.

9
How old are you prepared to go? The last of the Saabs have depreciated massively and make great family cars, but the newest of them are still at least four years old.

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Husband says 2010. Which Saab are you thinking?

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It all depends.

ADAC in Germany does calculations for new cars:

https://www.adac.de/_mmm/pdf/autokos...icht_47085.pdf

includes deprecation, AFAIK.

The thing is: you can't really predict. You can get lucky and drive 100k km without as much as replacing windshield-wipers, liquids and brake-pads. And you can get a lemon (known as "Montags-Auto" in Germany) and have it at the garage constantly.

Superb isn't sold that much in Switzerland (it's slightly cheaper than a Passat), so any data you get might be slightly skewed.

Germany has a very large selection of Passats, because it's one of the most-sold cars of that type ("sales-men car").

I would see if you can get something with a towbar, BTW.

It's nice for attaching a bike carrier and you can rent a trailer if you need to transport something very big.

Cars with towbars are usually much more expensive in Switzerland, though, due to them being "higher-end"-cars (e.g. usually at least 2.0l engine).

At least, from what I could see, browsing autoscout et.al)

12
Yes! Great idea about the towbar as with the little one we will soon have to have 3 bikes.

We are also considering raising our budget. Do you think that would help finding THE car with almost everything we want/need?

What I'm trying to assert is how much do we need to spend to have a recent car (not older than 2010) with less than 50.000 km, spacious, reliable... I know, I know maybe we are too ambitious and almost asking for a car that grills burgers and makes fries... but would we find such car if we spend a bit more?

13
Well, you can see for yourself (with autoscout24.ch and mobile.de) what your budget would buy, given a certain set of constraints.

When buying cars with towbars, it's really essential to know what the car has been towing. If the previous owner has towed a horse-trailer or a boat, that would not be ideal because that puts more strain on the gear-box for possibly extended periods of time - especially, if the engine isn't too powerful to beging with (sub 2.0l esp.).

It makes sense to set up an email subscription for your search and subsequently see which cars sell for what price and which cars stay in the lot forever.

If a bargain shows up, it's usually gone very fast.

This is true for almost everything you buy 2nd-hand - because advertised prices don't necessarily correspond to actual prices paid when the deals are closed.

See the vast amount of stuff on ricardo.ch with zero bids.

Of course, this all takes a bit of time.

14
I have email alerts so that I can see those patterns (don't want to buy the car that has been sitting there for months). I was just trying to limit the scope so that I don't receive 3000 car suggestions per day. And we do have time so let's see. Thank you!

Good point about the towbar. The thought of asking what the car has been towing never crossed my mind although it does seem obvious now that you've mentioned it.

What about servicing the car? Is it too different in terms of cost if it is a Mercedes, a Skoda or a Saab?

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I don't know that. I have had the same car for almost 15 years. Costs a fortune to maintain...

Depends on a lot of factors ("official" garage, warranty etc.pp.). And, of course, Mercedes is said to be a bit more pricey than others. But I have no data to back that up.

Any car is said to cost its list-price in maintenance over the years.

That back-of-the-envelope calculation certainly didn't factor-in the rent for my underground parking space...

16
German or Italian. Japanese, never again.

Currently have two 17 year old German cars, and one 5 year old. Thinking of adding an Italian, as my wife likes them (ten years old or so Panda 4x4).

Tom

17
I also will never go Japanese....they are just soooo dull.

I stay with the Germans.

Always loved the Mercedes wagons

Even includes warranty:

http://www.autoscout24.ch/de/d/merce...3d2010%26r%3d5

18
If you will keep it forever, make sure you get the spec you need and for possibly a change of use, like a daily commute.

A decent spec Octavia or Golf estate, plenty of them around so a lot on the market.

19
If you are interested in Skoda, this garage has super prices, new cars come with a 2 or 4 year European wide warranty,

http://www.autobuehler.ch/index.php?article_id=31

Herr Bühler has zero charm, his son has a little bit more.

20
This bmw 5 kombi with 4wheel drive

http://www.autoscout24.ch/3278509

the wheels are ugly though