Regarding this magical period of the year when you need to submit your tax form.
Had a little walk-through with the online form (logged in with the new application) and was wondering about the provisional tax burden, because I am sure I am not doing something correctly (also this would be my first year when I need to submit this)
So let’s put the magic number as income of 120.000, with all deductions possible (SBB/eat in town)… I still get over 10 k in Cantonal tax and about 2 k in the Federal Tax.
I understand that this is a high level estimation, but would be curious if you have similar values there or probably I forgot to add something, keeping in mind that I am also on a B permit (some taxes already payed).
I am initially trying to figure it out myself and not pay 700 CHF for “expat” friendly services, because I would like to be able to import the 2023 situation in the next year online.
PS → the whole site is Google translated for me, so off-course some words do not make sense there, but the main question is about the simulation after you insert all of your values/docs
PS1 → Most people I have talked about this told me that they either did not received anything to pay for the last years or it was around 1-2 k / year … that’s why I am asking for other opinions here … 12 k (sum of Federal + Cantonal) seems a bit off.
All the best,
Alex
10k of additional taxes after withholding tax sounds like a lot. Are you paying a lot of wealth tax? Did you deduct health expenses (health insurance and franchise)?
Exactly my thought…
Well I declared my savings accounts and it seems there are getting taxed also.
Added the health insurance / SBB – roughly 1500 , meals in town 3200 and I think this is the limit what I can put as deductions / added also some loan from my home country.
Also declared properties and cars (cheap ones) abroad, dunno if these are being taxed also … but yeah after talking to other colleagues (B permit / taxed at source) they pay up around 2 k , not 12-15 k (I would presume this would be the value for a C permit) , especially since I kinda payed around 12 k already (withholding)
Thanks,
Alex
What makes you think that the tax calculator takes into account what you have already paid. All calculators I have ever seen, incl. the online tax form in my canton, calculate total tax owed. So if it shows 12k owed and you know you have paid 12k already, you won’t have to pay anything on top.
And again, 10% effective tax on 120k in ZH does not sound wrong or high at all.
Well, maybe this is what I did not exactly understood →
Because you can not manually input in the form you permit type, the form does not differentiate between B,C,Swiss.
What you are saying is that the form is estimating my yearly taxes to be around 12 k–> the initial estimation … and when an accountant will get to my form he will do a simple math problem : Estimation sum (12 k) minus … oh, this guy is on a B so let’s see how much he already payed, so minus the taxes already payed during the year… will equal a result nearing 0 …
Is this how it is done, actually ?
Thanks
Sorry, English is not my primary language, but I would say “exclude” not include … let me give a more detailed example :
Let’s use these values :
gross per annum : 120.000
withhold for one year : 12.000
So when you add your income it asks for the value from nr 11 (from the annual salary report)–> which is the NET value from the “magical” 120.000 sum → it should be something like 108.000
After completing the form and adding all other deductions , I get an estimation for 10 k in Federal and 2 k in Cantonal (might be reversed)
So, this is why I would say it excludes the sum, because in the end I get a 12 k in taxes, and I could exclude the withholding , basically subtracting the total sum that was withheld
I believe that Nr 11 is your net salary before taxes, not after. The reduction from 120k to 108k is due to pension contributions, not the withholding tax.
In number 12 you should see the withholding tax amount, how does it compare to the tax estimation? If it’s higher you might even get some money back.
For nr 11 I have : Nettolohn / Rente – Salaire net / Rente – Net salary / Pension
For 12 : 12. Quellensteuerabzug – Retenue de l’impôt à la source – Withholding tax deduction
Because I earn a bit more I would still have probably between 2-3 k difference to pay , but this set my mind at ease because of the subtraction
From what I understand there is no way to indicate how much withholding tax you have paid in your declaration, so the platform shows the provisional taxes as if you were not taxed at source. And then the tax office would need to do the calculation taxes due (according to declaration) vs taxes already paid (via at source taxation).
did you ever figure it out? I am curious how did you proceed?
Are you taxed on your income at source? Or are you talking about withholding tax on such things as dividends? If it’s the latter, the whoever paid the dividend will supply you confirmation for the tax office…
I just postponed to them until the end of Nov … I think in the end the app gives a rough estimate of how much you could end up in paying … I am sure the state will do this in the end and send you a bill
Yes your online form just says how much in total your taxes are, which looks just right to me, then the tax office will calculate themselves how much were already paid by employer and how much is left (this is when you get Rechnung Definitiv), so if your quellensteuer were inline with 12k, then you pay nothing, so just wait for your Rechnung Definitiv
Yes, the tax office will take into account the tax already paid at source, but if you’d prefer to see the balance right away you can put the amount of tax paid in the prepaid provisional tax field. I guess it doesn’t create much confusion as when you’re taxed at source you don’t pay provisional tax. I did it once, just to see the balance, then I forgot and hit the submit. There was no complain or whatsoever. The final calculation was correct, so it works either way. By the way, when I went once to the tax office to ask for clarification whilst on permit B they re-directed me to a different building as the tax at source is handled by a different department. I’m mentioning that as this makes it somewhat reassuring that it’d be hard to see a mistake of not accounting the tax at source in the final calculation.
I get a 12 k in taxes, and I could exclude the withholding , basically subtracting the total sum that was withheld